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What could the fallout be from the Fed minutes?

November 18, 2015

We chat with Chris Temple about what he is looking for in the Fed minutes this afternoon. We take it a step further by what companies and investors are doing to potentially prepare for a rate hike in December and how this would impact economies around the world.

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Discussion
22 Comments
    Nov 18, 2015 18:00 AM

    Indeed. have Temple on later..hes your ace…

    bb
    Nov 18, 2015 18:24 AM

    I would think a rate rise would crush gold.

    bb
    Nov 18, 2015 18:30 AM

    Somebody was saying Doc was projecting gold price contradicting historical action in Dec.
    fomc dec 13-14?
    That meeting could be the answer.

    Nov 18, 2015 18:37 AM

    hiv………..std………….fed………..sic…………..

    Nov 18, 2015 18:04 AM

    A few news updates on the Uranium marketplace, since I know Mr T. has mentioned the stealth Uranium bull developing in recent posts. I have been very much in agreement and have been continuing to build positions in the quality names recently.
    __________________________________________________________________________

    Salman Partners: Uranium Prices to Rise from Now to 2018
    Kristen Moran • November 12, 2015

    ** Also scan down in the article to get these other updates:

    -Uranium news: China/US Nuclear Cooperation Agreement
    -Uranium news: M&A activity
    -Uranium news: Drill programs and results (Kivalliq Energy is mentioned Chris)

    http://investingnews.com/daily/resource-investing/energy-investing/uranium-investing/uranium-news-uranium-prices-expected-to-increase-as-inventories-shrink/?nameplate_category=Uranium%20Investing

      Nov 18, 2015 18:30 AM

      If you look at the pollution in the new industry countries, you know it is nuclear or death. It is that simple. You cannot adding pollutant to the air without getting people to revolt.

        Nov 18, 2015 18:42 AM

        Agreed Dragonite. Many emerging economies are not really looking at carbon-based options, and are going right to nuclear, wind, solar, geothermal, and hydroelectric. People also forget that nuclear is still growing in the US (we have a new reactor coming on line here in Tennessee for example). Nuclear is growing like crazy in China and their fleet will eventually dwarf anything Japan had or that France has. China has also strengthened it relations with France regarding nuclear power, reactors, and supply chains. S. Korea is a big player. Russia is a player. India, Turkey, United Arab Emirates, and several other countries in the Middle East are building and planning more reactors.

        Also, most of the longer term supply contracts with producers like Cameco, Areva, Uranium One, Energy Fuels, and Ur-Energy expire between now and 2018. Spot pricing will likely adjust upwards into the high $50’s to $60s over the next year or so; possibly getting back up to $70-$80 in 2-3 years.

        Now is the time to be a contrarian in this sector in the quality producers.

        So what do you think will happen to Denison and Fission now that they couldn’t pull off the merger. Will another company buy out Fission? Will Denison try to acquire a different advanced explorer? I’d be curious to get your thoughts.

          Nov 18, 2015 18:26 PM

          I am not qualified to offer my advice since I did lose money due to my poor judgement in this sector. You know much more than me. I feel you are a more expert in this sector. This sector is so opaque. Even the contract price is unknowlable for most of them. I sold out all my Dennison, Cameco, Uranium participation in 2007 when the price was rising to $137. So I make some good money back then. However, I add a few hundred Paladin shares in 2008 and added a lot more other shares in 2009-2010 betting the Russian supply will stop and new reactors will come on line. When my ideas were playing out and I started to off load some shares, Fukushima happened.I did not have any time to sell, the price were cut more than half for most miners in days. During the next few years, I tripled my position but share price kept tumbling. I did not realize the supply from Kazakhstan could increase so much. I also did not realize US could dump some stock pile on the market once a while. But the price of uranium is more or less followed my prediction even not as fast as I thought. The worst part of the story is that the price of Uranium does nothing to stop the slump of share prices. The share price went down a lot despite uranium price has steadily GONE UP. unbelievable. I guess people have lost patience. However, reactors cannot be built like other facilities so they will take much longer than people think. I think it is a result of fund short term view. They have changed the market. So at present, I am just concentration on a few seniors and intermediate producers like Cameco, and dennison. I have a bid on your UR Enegy as well. I may have to hold another 10 years to see my money back. Tough. But the low valuation makes me wonder, the super spike like Paladin (from 1 cent to 10 dollars) may happen again in the future. People have given up totally.

            Nov 18, 2015 18:54 PM

            Sorry for the grammar errors.

            Nov 18, 2015 18:13 PM

            Yes, that sounds like a similar story to many Uranium investors that were making money in 2006-2011, and then the Fukushima event cleaned their clocks. I also lost quite a bit of money in 2011 after that event, because I was more stunned at the speed and severity of the drop and that the whole world just gave up on Nuclear mentally (yet forgot that about 20% of the global power grid is supported by Nuclear, in addition to government installations that run small private nuclear power plants and nuclear submarines).

            In 2010 and 2011 the macro fundamental picture for nuclear power was so bright, that something like that, “a true black swan even” that came from out of nowhere, caught many off-guard. I averaged down again in early 2012, and had a prolonged painful experience until I completely sold out licking my wounds.

            For the end of 2012, 2013, and 2014 I just did short term swing tradesin the quality companies, and completely gave up on explorers in Uranium. This year I started picking up positions in select companies like Uranerz (now merged with Energy Fuels), Energy fuels (because I’ve actually held shares in 3 different companies they bought out), Uranium Energy Corp, Ur-Energy, Uranium Resources, Denison, Fission, and even some Paladin and Cameco from time to time. I had a few good runs this year, but recently will admit to having the 4 positions I still hold fall underwater.

            Thankfully I sold out of Denison in October and was spared the recent slide due to the botched merger. I’m considering getting back in to Denison soon as they are now getting oversold again, but it looks like the late September lows may get retested, so I’m just watching at present.

            I have just watched Denison for a long time and know they have a quality company, assets, & management, and know how to survive. Honestly, the combined company of Denison & Fission would have been a unique operation, but it was the Fission investors that didn’t understand the value Denison brought to the table. Most don’t know they have a whole environmental division that does mine site reclamation, or that they have tolling agreements at Cigar Lake, or that they have a number of JV partnerships in a great pipeline of projects. They are entrenched in the industry and well respected, but most of the Fission investors were die hard Canadian Athabasca Basin junkies and didn’t understand all the moving parts that Denison has, and just want to cash in on the promise that Fission shows as a potential lowest cost producer due to their high grades. I get it because there was a big difference in the interests in the shareholders of each group. I also see Fission as back on the market, and it is very likely another company will make them an offer as well, and their shareprice is a better value because it has tanked as well.

            As for Ur-Energy, I truly believe that longer term its going to have a great percentage increase relative to it’s peers, but yes it’s a waiting game at present.

            You are correct on the opaqueness of the industry, but if you want video interview, read company CEO interviews, and analysts, you start to realize that Cameco, Energy Fuels, Ur-Energy, and Uranium One all have long-term contracts that expire in the next few years that are in the high $50s ($56-$58 average). When those get renegotiated, the spot price will jump suddenly and will not be a slow grind up for years. It will catch most off-guard to the upside, as this commodity doesn’t behave like oil or the metals and is very thinly traded.

            As for Kazakhstan, you are right on. Nobody realized they’d be supplying over 20% of global uranium in just a few years…..but, as Marin Katusa pointed out earlier this year, he believes they blew their wad and will not be able to keep production at the same levels, and this will pinch supply in a major way.

            As for the US government with their “Megatons for Megawatts” campaign dismantling Russian and US warheads, that should have been over 2 years ago (2013-2014). However, it was announced that it officially ended, but the Obama regime continued to dump stockpiles of uranium into the open market after the cut-off date and this really messed up current producers. They all projected the supply that would be needed, ramped up output, and then got sucker punched by the US government and the Kazakhstan supply. This is why prices flatlined for the last few years (not just the Japan or Germany deals).

            Most of the excess is being mopped up presently, and over the net few years the bull will be back in force, and I expect this sector to be booming again in the 2018-2020 time frame, but many of the large percentage gains will have already happened by then. That is why my sights are set on 2016-2018.

            Nov 18, 2015 18:41 PM

            Very good information. I should have put more effort into uranium sector. Just I found it is not rewarding and not easy to understand the fundamentals. They drop in their share price unrelated to the result, a complete waste of time to read anything. It has the ear mark of complete capitulation. This hurts my feelings so I stay away from research since 2012 and close my eyes and buy once a while. I am thinking who cares, just buy some and some will survive. In particular I put most into Cameco and the dividend I got make me happy. It is the only U company I have made money. I am always scared of black swan event of small mining companies. They are actually white swans since there are so many. I checked your UR Energy and found it is one of the best smaller companies. That is why I placed some bid on TSX. I will treat it like another small(er) stock called UEX. Hope I will get it but I am not in a hurry. I still love the Athabasca Basin companies the most since their grade is way higher than the rest. They do have a better chance to survive and prosper. The break even price for most companies are $70. It might be lower sue to currency devaluation. When price is close to $60-70, we will see the relentless rise of the share prices since they start to turn from big loss to profitability.

            Thanks again for your information.

            BTW, I brought the fact that US dumps the stock pile to the market but I do NOT mean they try to manipulate uranium price. It is more to provide enough material these companies fail to secure I think. around 90% US uranium is imported.

            Nov 18, 2015 18:43 PM

            I should qualify that Cameco is the only company I have made money since Fukushima.

            Nov 19, 2015 19:20 AM

            Yes, the only way I’ve made money the last few years is swing trading the producers (Cameco, Areva, Uranerz, Energy Fuels, Ur-Energy, Paladin, and Uranium Energy Corp), and the two prior producers with projects waiting to come back on-line (Denison and Uranium Resources). I have not really fooled with the explorers as there are plenty of projects in place already and we just need the higher spot pricing.

            One last thing is that companies with insitu mining versus the hard rock mines only need $25-$35 Uranium to be profitable, not $70. This is why Cameco has been focusing on that side of their business, why Energy Fuels bought Uranerz, why Uranium Resources just acquired Anatolia Energy (insitu in Turkey), and why I am so impressed with Ur-Energy who is also an insitu producer.

            Right now, it is the insitu miners with this lower cost method of mining that are still able to operate in this low price environment. It is the hard rock miners like the other half of Cameco’s assets, Energy Fuels assets prior to acquiring Uranerz, Uranium Resources assets prior to acquiring Anatolia Energy, and Paladin that have suffered. This is also why the Athabasca basin in explorers like Fission is of such interest, because their grade is high enough to be profitable with $60 Uranium spot price.

            Lastly, I would say that monitoring the fundamental news reports did allow me to get in and out of these stocks at key times when they had good results, when I thought a merger was coming down the pike, and bought the rumor….sold on the news….

    Nov 18, 2015 18:10 AM

    Great discussion guys… You are getting close to hitting the nail on the head.
    The fed will raise rates when the liquidity event happens. When the US budget is opened and many other mechanisms take affect. The corporate buy-backs is the unwinding of QE. And when the music stops ( junk bonds fail and no more stimulus for the top 500 ) you will see the major decline. January should get interesting for the stock market, but Main Street will be on an uptrend. Watch and see.
    You guys are getting pretty close. Good job!

    Nov 18, 2015 18:21 AM

    I agree Chris is a great guest.

    Nov 18, 2015 18:28 AM

    charister maybe it is my enfeebled great age –but exactly WHAT r u talking about..
    thanks

      Nov 18, 2015 18:12 PM

      Agatha,
      I have gave them food for thought of how and why the fed will raise rates. The details are a long winded post, and I don’t do those.

        Nov 18, 2015 18:29 PM

        well chart= perhaps in your short wind you can try to be more clear. the food is indecipherable..
        thanks

    Nov 18, 2015 18:31 AM

    Good thoughts today on the interest rate issue and how different scenarios affect the USD, exports and imports, emerging market debt, and how that will affect the overall markets. Thanks guys.

    Nov 18, 2015 18:31 PM

    Johnson Matthey Sees Supply Deficits For Platinum, Palladium In 2015
    Wednesday November 18, 2015

    http://www.kitco.com/news/2015-11-18/Johnson-Matthey-Sees-Supply-Deficits-For-Platinum-Palladium-In-2015.html

      Nov 18, 2015 18:33 PM

      Thanks EX…………

        Nov 19, 2015 19:19 AM

        I know you and few other follow the PGMs, so that should be bullish longer term.