Weekend Show – Sat 21 Apr, 2012

Gold Manipulation and Passport Potash Site Visit

Click download link to listen on this device: Download Show

In the first hour we focus on gold and the question of price manipulation and in the second hour we focus on a specific company. We visited this company this past week and came away with interviews and a soon to be released video. See what you think. Remember we do not give investment advice as we are not registered investment advisers. We simply discuss companies that we are interested in. And, as you know, we give three days notice before we buy or sell any stock which we discuss in this forum.

  • Segment 1 – Olivier Garret, CEO of Casey Research, weighs in on gold price manipulation.
  • Segment 2 – Peter Grandich continues the discussion.
  • Segment 3 – Dr. Michael Berry summarizes what he feels are the three main factors driving gold.
  • Segment 4 – John Embry wraps up this discussion with a strong argument for those folks who feel that precious metals manipulation is a major issue.
  • Segment 5 – David Salisbury, Chairman of Passport Potash, explains what to expect from the company over the next 12 months
  • Segment 6 – Dennis Ickes talks about the progress Passport Potash is making in negotiations with the Hopi Indians on their Holbrook property.
  • Segment 7 – Fund Managers, Brokers and Analysts have a Q&A with the Passport Potash Management.
  • Segment 8 – Roger Wiegand explains why he believes Passport Potash is worth a serious look.



Click download link to listen on this device: Download Show

Click download link to listen on this device: Download Show

Click download link to listen on this device: Download Show

Click download link to listen on this device: Download Show

Click download link to listen on this device: Download Show

Click download link to listen on this device: Download Show

Click download link to listen on this device: Download Show

Click download link to listen on this device: Download Show

John EmbryOlivier GarretPeter GrandichMichael BerryRoger WiegandDavid Salisbury
Al Korelin

  1. On April 21, 2012 at 9:22 am,
    Clay says:

    Al: Another #1 weekend report. I have to say, to paraphrase you, that you work hard and the results show. Your program is becoming a real Gem and if others out there who have not yet tuned in, they will to their advantage when they view their understanding of what is happening start to rise.

    Thank you.

    • On April 21, 2012 at 2:43 pm,
      Irishtony says:

      CLAY. I have to agree with you. BIG AL must be very proud of his site, it is going from strength, to strength. Great guests, but in my opinion, even better bloggers . ALL you Fellow’s on here are truly street wise , you are all way ahead of the curve…Respect to you all.

      • On April 21, 2012 at 5:48 pm,
        Big Al says:

        Mr. Irish,

        What have I been saying, and I am blue in the face, this show is all about you and you and you and you, etc.

        Together we are strong and separate we are weak!

        Big Al

    • On April 21, 2012 at 5:47 pm,
      Big Al says:

      Many thanks, Clay!

      Big Al

      • On April 22, 2012 at 6:28 am,
        Clay says:

        Al: You and anyone will want to listen to this:


        I will be checking back to on this or your next pages to see if you did listen.

        • On April 22, 2012 at 9:02 am,
          Big Al says:

          Thanks for bringing Chris to my attention. I had not heard of him before.

          My philosophy is that we need to get as much input as we possibly can. Agreeing or disagreeing is not the question. The issue is simply to listen so you have as much input as possible.


          Big Al

          • On April 22, 2012 at 9:57 am,
            Clay says:

            Al, I think you and Chris will like each other very much, as I consider the two of you being in the top 5 of all people I read, listen to and enjoy. And that would be top 5 out of nearly 100.

            Your philosophy does you well, I completely agree.

            I should contact you sometime. Clay

          • On August 24, 2012 at 11:43 pm,
            Rodrigo says:

            his disciples would go on to do getaerr things than even he had done, and I don’t think that is limited to the Apostles.Regarding the uniqueness of Jesus even if 90% of what we know about Jesus is a fabricated myth (and I don’t believe it is that high), I won’t write it off to mere happenstance that he came into the world at the right place and time, and with the right words and actions, to become the keystone for a tremendously (and arguably the single most) significant social and spiritual movement in history. To me that suggests there were and are some very special metaphysics at work. With this understanding, out of all the avatars, seers, saints and sages in history, to profess Jesus Christ as my Lord and Savior is to acknowledge the story of the man we call Jesus as the one I find most compelling, and that it led me to know the spirit of Christ, the Logos, as my primary guide. Finally, I don’t think that once a person professes Christianity all other options are then off the table, such that to follow or even convert to another tradition is to be shunned by God. I hear the spirit of Christ repeatedly telling me that God doesn’t play favorites. Yes, I’m a universalist.

        • On April 22, 2012 at 9:59 am,
          Irishtony says:

          CLAY….Thanks for the link………..Thats why i keep shouting BUY PHYSICAL SILVER.

  2. On April 21, 2012 at 9:30 am,
    shawn says:

    Hi Al, I am having trouble with the audio for Saturday’s program although I can pick up the older shows crystal clear maybe it is on my end can anyone else substantiate this.

    • On April 21, 2012 at 9:50 am,
      shawn says:

      The problem has resolved itself, thanks, Shawn

    • On April 21, 2012 at 5:50 pm,
      Big Al says:

      Hi Shawn,

      Send an e-mail to Carter. (carter@evenkeelmedia.com)


      Big Al

  3. On April 21, 2012 at 9:36 am,
    Dennis M. O'Neil says:

    Below is a link to an article in the WSJ today top of page 4. On the WSJ web page you really have to look for it….it is titled “Scandals Give Obama a Headache”.
    In the article there is an awesome pull quote from Michael Tanner a senior fellow of the Cato Institute….”The Obama administration has to explain why we shouldn’t look at this and question government”….”If the government can’t organize a two-car motorcade without stopping at a brothel do we really want to put them in charge of health care?”

    This quote made me think of:
    1) SEC employees watching porn at work while they took a pass on Bernie Madoff tips delivered to them on a platter for a decade;
    2) Bill Clinton and his insatiable appetite for the tawdry…need we revisit the taint;
    3) John Edwards and his election camerawoman’s child…scandal..and pending prison sentence;
    4) Jesse Jackson Sr. evidently did not listen to Joycelyn Elder’s advice about condom use;
    5) What about Al Gore massage sexual therapy;
    6) Then there is the then 19 year old Mimi Alford’s tell all about JFK;
    7) And do you remember why Ted Kennedy brandished a neck brace..poor Mary Jo Kopechne a high price for taking a ride with a married man.

    Yesturday this blog made detailed reference to Nigel Farage. The above elitist scum reminds me of Mr. Farage’s calling out the vipers at the EU when he so eliquently said in November 2010 “Just who the hell do you think you people are?”
    One curious thing is that the current Secret Service scandal does not add up.
    There were 20 hookers but only 12 Secret Service.
    It was obvious the scandal would be very tawdry and/or the WH had a math problem.
    After quickly adding 5 more “Americans” and 5 “military personnel” the math problem was seemingly overcome.
    22 American’s and 20 hookers…all is right with the world….but the idea of a Secret Service fraternity party sharing hookers is not pretty. It is the equivalent of the Duke lacrosse players untrue accusations coming to life.
    At least they paid the stripper.
    However all the above 22 were not involved. They were implicated because of this math problem. Why so many hookers?
    A curious facebook picture appears of an agent being kissed by two women as if to pre-empt the above math problem saying at least some of these Agents needed more than 1 hooker.
    Nothing being out of the realm of possibility.
    But when we look at number 1 through 7 above…is it out of the realm of possibility that advance people from the White House were involved?
    With history as our guide….. could the advance party have been diligently interviewing women for those who would arrive later.
    It sounds to me like there was a 20 hooker cattle call casting couch interview.
    Maybe a girl won the pageant and was being held in reserve for later use.
    Sure this is speculation. But this speculation will be supported if say special lenient treatment is given to key Secret Service…like allowing them to retire with benefits.
    This scandal is not over by a long shot.
    Sometimes you have to wonder why you would want to spend your birthday in Chicago without your family.
    To me this sounds like a a move 1 through 7 would try. “Honey take Sasha to Spain with you… Malia is at summer camp….I will spend my birthday all alone! I might go to Chicago to be all alone though!”
    “Who the hell do these people think they are?”
    If Obama….has inclinations as 1 through 7 above…. and has any brains… he is taking heed of all of Joycelyn Elder’s sordid advice.

    • On April 21, 2012 at 6:47 pm,
      John W. Robertson says:

      Let’s talk bad strategies.

      Prior to being nominated by the DNC, Obama was asked if he would follow bin Laden into Pakistan if needed. He said, “yes” and caught hell from Pakistan for it. (Inexperienced rookie mistake…he should have said he’d have an agreement with Pakistan in advance of any such possibility). Off point but of interest, and very co-incidentally (or not), this situation was exactly what would happen 3 years later. And all with a composition-perfect photo looking back into the Situation Room to capture it all…my, wasn’t it fortunate a photographer was available and allowed in to capture all the drama on Hillary’s and everyone else’s faces. It’s not like it could ever have been staged or anything. But I’m getting off topic.

      Next, send Obama around the world in 8 days on a Apology Tour. Heck, throw in a Nobel Peace Prize for good measure. Now there’s a projection of power and confidence. What abysmal political adviser thought those ones up??

      On to the Dems losing their House advantage in 2009 due to open seat elections. One by one, Democrat retirements caught the White House by surprise, until it was too late in Nov 2009 when they realized the Republicans might actually win two more by-elections and even-out the House. Poor political strategy, but even worse, non-existent awareness of the political climate in the country until it was too late, born out of arrogance.

      Imagine this. Your nicest, flashiest stealth drone crashes in Iran. Response? “Can we please have it back? Pretty-please?? With sugar on it??” My words of course, but diplomatically, that’s about the same effect Obama’s response had.

      Wikileaks. Enough said.

      So who should Obama appoint after winning the Presidency? How about a few draconian left-wing advisories back from da hood? You know, people who would really have developed a name for themselves and garner international respect? Some said Palin had no experience…and like a community organizer and a bunch of anarchists from Chicago were just fine, though.

      Now take a president who gives the same speech, word-for-word, pause-for-pause, slanted eyebrow-for-slanted eyebrow, in different locations. Talk about rehearsed. He should trade in his Peace Prize for an Academy Award. It’s one thing to re-tread some well-written prose. It’s another to repeat ‘insightful pauses’, as if he were speaking on the spur of the moment. Mark Twain would walk out.

      There’s so many more. And now we have Dennis O’Neil’s analysis of unfortunate and inconvenient hooker-to-secret service ratios. Too many women, not enough agents. What to do?? Oh, the humanity. Hey, I know. Let’s drop-kick some other agents along with them.

      Today, Charles Colson passed away, the disgraced (later redeemed) special counsel to Pres. Nixon. The Dems might wish to review his struggles. They might learn from it.

      • On April 22, 2012 at 7:12 am,
        Dennis M. O'Neil says:

        John I think I was off topic first.

        Mr. Edwards faces a six week trial in Greensboro as we type.
        But John do you remember the December 2007 National Enquirer story about John Edwards: http://www.nationalenquirer.com/celebrity/update-john-edwards-love-child-scandal. With John Edward’s now on trial for the cover-up we know he then knew this story was true.
        John W. ……why is it so easy for a leftist to lie?
        Answer: because in their Machiavellian view lies are permitted (call them revolutionary truths) if they further the ultimate goal.
        John another question….any reporter back in December 2007 mainstream media world could have confirmed the National Enquirer story and buried Edward’s campaign. Why didn’t they?
        If John Edward’s withdrew from the race in face of the scandal or if his campaign was legitimately forced to limp into Iowa disgraced…where would his 29.7% of the Iowa votes have been cast.

        Something to ponder.

        What would have happened if Bill Clinton told the truth in his 1992 post Super Bowl Sunday 60 minutes interview?
        What would have happened if Ted Kennedy told the truth about Chappaquiddick?
        Why are we OK with Chris Dodd receiving discounted mortgages from Countrywide’s friend of Mozilo fund?
        Why are we OK with the Clinton’s cattle future extreme prowess and Whitewater?
        Why were we recently OK with the way Barrack and Michele scammed with Tony Rezko their Chicago digs?
        Did this foreshadow Solyndra? It certainly did. Are we suckers for corruption?
        Conservatives in similar circumstances are forced to face the music and a hostile press. It is as if the right continues to be issued detention and the left has a perpetual hall pass.

        Final point that makes all the above somewhat suitable and less off topic here…….

        Our leaders were themselves first debased before they debased our currency and our culture.

        It is a result of all of the above that government is required to manipulate the precious metals. It is the Machiavellian way. Lie to them…let them eat cake….. We all know where this rhyme in our time leads.

  4. On April 21, 2012 at 9:38 am,
    shawn says:

    I just read an interview with Doug Casey and he say’s and I quote “We have bankrupt governments trying to bail out the European banks, which are bankrupt because they’ve loaned money to the bankrupt government. Keeping things succinct is one of his hallmarks.

    • On April 22, 2012 at 9:10 am,
      Big Al says:

      Pretty hard to disagree with Doug and that, Shawn!

      Big Al

  5. On April 21, 2012 at 9:45 am,
    Michael says:

    Thanks for the detailed look at Passport Potash.

    • On April 22, 2012 at 9:12 am,
      Big Al says:

      Morning Michael,

      Remember that was not a solicitation to necessarily buy the stock.

      I think that PPI is a very interesting company run by a large group of, what appear to be, competent individuals.

      I hope for their sakes and for the sakes of the shareholders that they do delineate a major resource and eventually put it into production.


      Big Al

  6. On April 21, 2012 at 9:47 am,
    philo says:

    You’re in a communist country with a public cash supply facilitated by private bankers. You managed to work the system to become much more wealthy than most. Congratulations. Employment opportunities for the Hopi? It’s their natural resources. Money(an accounting tool) is nothing more than the “intellectual property” of greedy intellectuals.

    • On April 21, 2012 at 10:14 am,
      Dennis M. O'Neil says:

      Thanks for making me think!
      While pondering your post….I decide to make Baklava tonight.
      Thank you!

      • On April 22, 2012 at 9:17 am,
        Big Al says:

        Morning Dennis O,

        One of Big Al’s favorites!

        Big Al

        • On April 22, 2012 at 2:34 pm,
          Dennis M. O'Neil says:

          I just finished a batch of Sweedish Meatballs.
          Family favorite!
          Simmering ready to eat except for Egg Noodles.
          I could could either way with the wine…..this is a night I let my wife choose.

          • On April 22, 2012 at 6:21 pm,
            Big Al says:

            Swedish meatballs? Holy smoke another one of Big Al’s favorites!

            What time is dinner tomorrow?

            Big Al

    • On April 21, 2012 at 11:57 am,
      Matthew says:

      Philo, who are you congratulating for working the system? Al? His guests? Are you suggesting that it is wrong to protect yourself by investing wisely? Also, is it fiat money that you have a problem with, or is real money included? Please clarify.

      • On April 21, 2012 at 12:56 pm,
        philo says:

        I have a problem with a private entity producing the public cash supply and anyone that thinks that this doesn’t have to be remedied immediately.

        • On April 21, 2012 at 1:26 pm,
          Matthew says:

          I agree, but the remedy is not to hand the same power to a “public” entity. Money out thin air is the tool of tyrants, no matter it’s source.

          • On April 21, 2012 at 1:53 pm,
            philo says:

            The publics cash should be facilitated by a public entity. Private brokerages should handle checking and pooling of resources by the facilitation of stock.

          • On April 21, 2012 at 2:33 pm,
            Matthew says:

            Money should NOT have counterparty risk. Money should be whatever the market says it is. Without real money, both inflation and government size and power will grow relentlessly until the system collapses under it’s own unsustainable weight. The situation would be no different than the current one. You cannot print capital, PERIOD. Printing can only transfer capital from it’s rightful owner to those who receive the printed money first -until there is no more capital left to transfer.
            Without real money, with intrinsic value, any perceived individual freedom is an illusion.
            In an excerpt highlighted toward the end of this article: http://news.goldseek.com/GoldSeek/1334944357.php Harry Schultz describes perfectly why gold is necessary.

          • On April 21, 2012 at 2:53 pm,
            philo says:

            Intrinsic is an oxymoron – in out. If anything, a dollar is intrinsic – a debit to one, a credit to another. It’s only an accounting tool. The problem is the accountant is charging usury. People like Harry are the reason people will invariably go to a guy with a huge vault of gold, doing NOTHING, for the facilitation of currency. http://fauxcapitalist.com/2011/03/27/the-gold-double-standard/

          • On April 21, 2012 at 4:50 pm,
            Matthew says:

            Gold has intrinsic value for the same reason all other raw materials do. It requires capital, labor, and risk, to produce. It also has many applications, but none as important as it’s role as money. As an accounting tool, or a measure of value, nothing else comes even close to gold’s suitability. It is the best proxy for all things real. It’s value, relative to raw materials, labor, houses, cars, education, healthcare, you name, is more stable than any other money ever used. On top of that, it can be stored for as long as you like without special care since it does not corrode or lose it’s value. It is fungible, that is, each unit is the same as every other unit, no matter where it is mined. Unlike diamonds, it is not subject to cut, carat, color, or clarity. Unlike paper money, it is not subject to the financial or political condition of any issuer. It is the only global money that would enhance individual liberty, not diminish it.

            To suggest that the dollar is an accounting tool is ridiculous. Unlike the meter, mile, kilo, or pound, the dollar is not what it used to be. The average house in 1920 was about $3,000; the average price of a car was about $250; gasoline was 20 cents; a barrel of oil was $3. Tuition at Yale was about $650 in 1920, or about 32 ounces of gold. Today, it is still about 32 ounces of gold, but has gone up 85 fold in dollars to around $55,000. This inert metal has also provided a far superior inflation hedge than the Dow has. Since 1971, gold is up over 40 fold while the Dow is up about 14 fold. In the real world, the Dow has actually done much worse due to all the deletions and subsequent additions. The composition of the Dow today has little in common with the Dow an investor would have purchased in 1971.

          • On April 22, 2012 at 7:29 am,
            Dennis M. O'Neil says:

            Let a public entity ‘coin’ money and let private mints do the same.
            End the tender laws.
            Let multiple forms of money compete in the market.
            Our current monetary system is analogous to the Public School System.
            There is no level competition.
            In order to send your child to a private school you have to pay property tax for a service you do not receive.
            We shouldn’t a property owner be able to direct his property taxes by voucher to the school of his choice.
            When allowed…. this format is so popular it requires lotteries to select because it is over subscribed.
            The same would be true with multiple currencies in circulation.
            Let the market separate good money from bad. Let Gresham’s Law influence what we save. This is exactly why some of us have bags of junk silver and the 7-11 has what it has in it’s cash register till.
            There will always be an economy…let circulate what the magnitude of market decisions prefers.

          • On April 22, 2012 at 1:20 pm,
            philo says:

            You could have a bunch of different currencies, but if someone is charging usury for paper loans it’s because the rest of the nation is too dumb to figure out how stupid that is and will still be under the control of bankers. I could say if someone isn’t charging usury for paper loans, the rest of the nation would wake up, but the communities who are lending paper usury free insist that it isn’t a loan. They try to say there’s no borrowing because they don’t have anyone sign a formal promissory obligation. Luckily, people(not bankers) do have a conscience and will generally police themselves by producing something in turn for what they purchase. I would think if there was a list of everyone the currency was issued to, people would have more confidence in it. If you take a piece of paper in exchange for a product(sell), you are actually a lender of a product and the borrower of a piece of paper. If you are issued a piece of paper with which you buy something with, you are a borrower of paper(paper debt), a borrower of product(real debt), and a lender of paper. Buy, sell – debt involved. Trade – no debt. The amount of any currency has to be regulated by a central authority so it doesn’t inflate out of control, and the people it was issued to feel an obligation to give it back some day.

        • On April 21, 2012 at 1:33 pm,
          Dennis M. O'Neil says:

          Philo…I agree with you and I like Greek food.

          • On April 21, 2012 at 3:19 pm,
            Dennis M. O'Neil says:

            I do not agreed with your collectivists money creation conclusion.
            I agree with Mark…let the market decide what is money…
            what is a
            1) medium of exchange
            2) unit of account
            3) store of wealth.

            I guarantee the government can easily provide for 1 and 2…the problem is with the likes of Barney Franks and Maxine Waters they can never create a mediumof exhange/unit of excahnge that stores wealth. Wealth is repelled from centralized money like a drop of rain on a fast moving car’s windshield with RainX recently applied.

          • On April 21, 2012 at 3:59 pm,
            philo says:

            You have more in common with Franks and Waters than I do.

          • On April 21, 2012 at 4:07 pm,
            philo says:

            Anyone who doesn’t recognize that left wing rhetoric is written by the same people who write the right wing rhetoric is all the same – controlled opposition. Complaining how much people that don’t even produce anything are taxed – progressiveness. If there was a flat tax, you couldn’t fight with each other.

          • On April 21, 2012 at 4:23 pm,
            philo says:

            I never said give anyone money. You have to give it back at the end of your career, after you save a bunch of stuff like gold for your retirement. That is if your into storing treasures on Earth. A private bank is charging usury for lending out paper. Everything in this upside down world stems from that fact.

          • On April 21, 2012 at 4:55 pm,
            Marc says:

            Excellent “school” lesson – Matthew!

          • On April 22, 2012 at 2:44 pm,
            Dennis M. O'Neil says:

            Philo what you complain about in your 1:20 PM post is the way the world existed prior to 1694 and the establishment of The Bank of England.
            And even after 1694 many jurisdictions thrived until being strangled by Central Banks of thier own.
            My question to you is…In the history of Cental Banking name one Central Bank that has accomplish it’s stated purpose.
            At this point we agree…but from there I agree with Matthew….shifting money issuance from one privatized agent of the elite to an elected one is akin to the street vendor apt with walnut shells shifting the pea as your wallet is harvested.
            Back to my Sweedish meatballs!!!

          • On April 22, 2012 at 4:07 pm,
            philo says:

            I’m not talking about having a central bank. I’m talking about no bank. A bookkeeper that writes down a number on a ledger under someone’s name, then issues them some paper bills or a check is not a banker. All funding for the common use infrastructure(government) should come from taxation(flat taxation). NO “borrowing”. The books should be open for the public to see. From there on you would have to save for all your purchases, or find investors to form a company that you can work at, at the brokerage that handles your checking account. Theoretically, there would always be employment, and money to save, with no insane bankers controlling the planet.

        • On April 21, 2012 at 5:56 pm,
          philo says:

          Ooh inflation! Yea, like anyone’s going to save 3k for 90 years. Bankers extracting billions for cutting down a tree, making paper to loan out because you will borrow gold and think you’re not getting ripped off because you don’t know how to make a debt instrument out of paper. Gold, like any commodity has value. It’s not in out value. Even poop can be used as fertilizer if it sits in the sun long enough. Gold should be used for something other than sitting in a vault doing nothing but making bankers the most powerful people on Earth.

          • On April 21, 2012 at 7:28 pm,
            Matthew says:

            There was no inflation between 1800 and 1900. Get the point? For those who actually work hard and live within their means, there ought to be a safe way to save what they’ve earned, don’t ya think? People should not have to take on risk and become sophisticated investors in order to protect their savings. Many don’t have the interest nor the ability to grasp what’s necessary in a fiat (corrupt) system.

            What point are you attempting to make with your second sentence? I never said that I was for fractional reserve banking. If private parties want to engage in borrowing/lending, that should be their business.
            What do you mean by “in out” value?

            Who are you to say what someone’s private property should be used for? If gold sitting in a vault is so scary to you, why do you wish to help it remain there? That is, after all, what you are doing by foolishly demanding that something other than gold should be used for money.

            Since 90 years is just too much for you, let’s go back 40 years. In 1970, the average car price was less than $4000. The average house was less than $25,000. Gasoline was 36 cents. Oil was $2.50 to $3.00 (same as 1920!). Yale tuition was $2550, and, thanks to Nixon’s ending of the dollar-gold link, $6210 by 1980. In 2000, Yale tuition was less than half what it is today. You really don’t think such moves would make planning a challenge for parents who are trying to save for their children’s education? Meanwhile, their wages are falling in real terms (purchasing power). The entire middle class is on the same accelerating treadmill that has already pitched millions into poverty.

          • On April 21, 2012 at 8:24 pm,
            philo says:

            If there was no bank, there would be nothing to save. If you add up every dollar worth of promissory obligations at every bank, you’ll find it roughly equals the amount of every dollar in every checking account, savings account, and physical bill/coin. Bankers collect usury on the cash supply. There is no fraction of anything. They expand and contract the cash supply as they will. I could care less if someone has a vault of gold as long as they’re not facilitating the cash supply. Intrinsic – Latin – in out. Yes, relations between things change in a manipulated market, like the education of a garbage Yale economics degree. Bankers create poverty so we have something to talk about other than getting rid of them.

          • On April 21, 2012 at 9:29 pm,
            Matthew says:

            Now you “could care less if someone has a vault of gold.” That’s an about-face from “Gold should be used for something other than sitting in a vault doing nothing…” But I’ll take it.

            I don’t see anything pertinent to the dialog in your statement that “If there was no bank, there would be nothing to save.” My argument is simply that gold and silver should be used as money as they were prior to the civil war. The gold standard that came later is not the model that would be argued for by any Austrian economist. The link you provided earlier contained a critique only of this deeply flawed gold standard in an attempt to “debunk” gold’s merit as money.

            Your statement that “relations between things change…” has nothing to do with the examples that I provided. Neither does your opinion of Yale. The examples I gave show that the relationship between gold and virtually ALL goods and services remains remarkably consistent -manipulation or not. Fiat paper hides this fact.

            “intrinsic – Latin intrinsecus, “on the inside,” came to be the English intrinsic, “inner, internal” and “inherent.” – thefreedictionary.com

            From Merriam-Webster:
            Origin of INTRINSIC

            French intrinsèque internal, from Late Latin intrinsecus, from Latin, adverb, inwardly; akin to Latin intra within — more at intra-
            First Known Use: 1635

          • On April 21, 2012 at 9:51 pm,
            philo says:

            There you go, here’s what I think of Austrian Economics http://recoveringaustrians.wordpress.com/ No matter what kind of gold standard there is or was, bankers were ripping people off. Why don’t you just take your bills, buy gold, and let those of us who know that if no one borrows from a bank, there would be no money, nothing to save, only barter, and a very slow going economy, reform monetary policy. A public bookkeeper should take over all current mortgages and stop the interest accruement. Issue currency usury free to individuals as the debt previously mentioned is extinguished. Now there would be money to save with no banker parasite. No more mortgages. You save to buy. No more defaults, which is actually the main cause of inflation. Inner value. Wow.

          • On April 21, 2012 at 10:18 pm,
            Matthew says:

            I took my “bills” and bought gold long ago. The CURRENT system requires borrowing. Every dollar is loaned into existence. Gold and silver as money have no such requirement. Defaults cause deflation. Inflation is the result of policymakers’ response to defaults. Your government issued paper would lead to all the same problems. Connected entities would still get bailed out. It’s funny to distinguish between a small group of powerful men in banking from those in government. Power will be abused no matter the title of those who have it. Gold empowers the individual. Wow indeed.

          • On April 22, 2012 at 12:24 am,
            philo says:

            If I borrow a dollar into existence, buy something, then default on the dollar, that means I won’t be producing anything to capture the dollar back to extinguish the debt. That dollar is actually worthless, but it’s effect is to dilute our perception of what a dollar is worth – dilute the money supply. Now it takes more dollars to equal the same amount of debt as before, so yes, if the bank doesn’t facilitate the creation of more debt(dollars), you will have deflation which in our culture means unemployment. Banks don’t have to force defaults, but if they didn’t, people might figure out they don’t actually lend anything but paper. Gold empowers those with huge vaults of it to control the money supply so they don’t have to sell it in order to pay the guards of their mansions. They don’t produce anything to pay the guards with. People will always create a paper debt currency, as many communities do, in an effort to keep themselves employed and keep what they earn. It’s just a matter of doing it right, and on a national scale.

          • On April 22, 2012 at 12:43 am,
            philo says:

            To clarify, dollars(debt) are being created and extinguished on a daily basis. If the pressure extinguishing them(by payments to the bank) out ways the pressure creating them(bank loans), the cash supply contracts – depression. Less money in everyone’s pocket because there’s less money. There could potentially be too much debt than necessary causing inflation but you are going to have a booming economy.

          • On April 22, 2012 at 8:55 am,
            Matthew says:

            Paper money is not necessary for employment, as you say. It also does not help anyone “keep what they earn.” It does just the opposite!

            More currency in circulation does not mean more value in everyone’s pocket. Wealth is being concentrated into fewer and fewer hands -despite exploding money supply growth. Paper money expedites this process of wealth consolidation.

            Stable money empowers everyone. Gold is the most stable money there is. Debt based money (paper) hurts nearly everyone. When gold itself is used as money, no one with “huge vaults of gold” has any control over the money supply.

          • On April 22, 2012 at 11:13 am,
            philo says:

            Well, there’s community currencies that are perfectly stable all over the planet helping to keep people employed. No gold involved.

        • On April 22, 2012 at 9:19 am,
          Big Al says:

          Actually, philo, PPI is not a private entity. The company has a fairly long list of shareholders.

          I can understand your feelings but, in this case, I cannot agree with them.


          Big Al

        • On April 22, 2012 at 9:36 am,
          Big Al says:

          Morning philo,

          I assume here that you are referring to the Fed.

          Big Al

    • On April 22, 2012 at 9:17 am,
      Big Al says:

      I guess the question that I would have, philo, is has anyone helped the Hopi to put this potential asset into production. Perhaps more importantly, have they done anything themselves to advance this potential asset?

      What has anyone else done to try to lower the unemployment rate in this part of the world.

      By the way, I am unaware of any private bankers who have facilitated the work on this project.

      Pretty easy to throw stones in cases like this but realism always comes into play!


      Big Al

      • On April 22, 2012 at 11:32 am,
        philo says:

        .Obviously everyone would be employed and working all the time if there was no money. Unfortunately we are conditioned to believe we need it to get anything done. Contraction of the money supply causes unemployment. If you want to help the Hopi, teach them how to properly create a currency(wampum) so they can use it to pool their labor resources by the creation of stock so they can extract the natural resources themselves. Someone could loan them the equipment and be employed teaching them how to use it for a share of what is extracted. But I don’t live in reality. It’s a dog eat dog world.

        • On April 22, 2012 at 12:42 pm,
          Matthew says:

          Everyone would be employed all the time if there was no money? Yeah, everyone would be looking for grubs under rocks to avoid starvation.
          Money has allowed individuals to specialize based on their strengths and interests. Money is the number one factor responsible for civilization’s achievements -medical, technological, etc. The poor in the U.S., and many other places, have a higher standard of living and a longer life expectancy than a king of centuries ago.
          When money is corrupted, society follows. If money ceases to exist, so will civilization as you know it.
          Boy, you said it; you don’t live in reality.

          • On April 22, 2012 at 1:01 pm,
            philo says:

            Goldism – practiced by people who will argue that bankers are charging usury on paper loans because it’s not “backed by gold”. So therefore, the paper has to be backed by gold so bankers can charge usury. If your dumb enough to pay usury for a paper loan, you’re not going to be smart enough to not let bankers run your life.

          • On April 22, 2012 at 1:28 pm,
            Matthew says:

            I said gold is money, NOT paper. There should be NO paper at all, backed or unbacked.
            You are coming from a purely emotional, wishful place. Logic should tell you that your paper would be inflated away like any other.

          • On April 22, 2012 at 3:09 pm,
            philo says:

            oooh, your talking about a barter economy that has no debt, only direct trade. I might come to the conclusion that is the only answer.

        • On April 22, 2012 at 2:43 pm,
          Big Al says:

          Of course that is a good point, Philo

          My question remains, “why have they not done it themselves to this point”?

          You must admit that is really the point.

          Big Al

          • On April 22, 2012 at 3:06 pm,
            philo says:

            Same reason you let people go to a parasite for their money – lack of education.

          • On April 22, 2012 at 3:15 pm,
            Matthew says:

            Now you’re blaming Al for the monetary system? Priceless!

          • On April 22, 2012 at 3:21 pm,
            philo says:

            You can buy things with the money you have because people with promissory obligations to the bank are producing stuff. Why should they pay the parasitic middle man usury so you can have money in your bank? It’s called “the physics of money”.

          • On April 22, 2012 at 3:30 pm,
            Matthew says:

            That’s fine, but Al is on the right side of this debate. To the best of my knowledge (I’m 99.9% sure), he is for sound money, not this ponzi system of debt pyramiding that enriches the big banks at society’s expense.

          • On April 22, 2012 at 3:50 pm,
            philo says:

            If by “sound money”, you are referring to “gold backed”, that would actually be “insane banker money”. Sound money would be money not facilitated by a private banker.

          • On April 22, 2012 at 4:45 pm,
            Matthew says:

            Did you forget already? I’m talking about gold ITSELF. Not paper with “backing.” Gold would be “facilitated” by the market and mining. By the way, there is no money as sound as gold. There are mountains of evidence to support this claim. By definition, paper is not money. At best, it is a receipt for money, a claim -no different than a dry cleaners ticket. Otherwise, paper is just a currency, and a poor one at that.

        • On April 22, 2012 at 8:09 pm,
          thesophist says:

          Well, well, well, Eric is back. Where have you been boy? Thought you dropped off the face of the earth.

          • On April 23, 2012 at 6:40 am,
            Eric says:

            Wow, aren’t you clever. You just don’t get around much.

      • On April 22, 2012 at 12:09 pm,
        philo says:

        Interestingly, it was the Native Americans eidetic way of communication that made them non-conformists in the first place. It just doesn’t make sense to a rational mind to pay usury to someone who lends you a piece of paper or gold coin. They would draw pictures of animals in bondage to give to the settlers. Now there are Native American banks popping up. Pathetic.

        • On April 23, 2012 at 8:50 am,
          thesophist says:

          No philo, I’m not nearly so clever. One of my hobbies, that stems from my many years as a law enforcement officer, is to study people, their habits, traits, personalities, writing styles, thought processes, grammatical style, punctuation, syntax, emotional and intellectual predispositions and leanings, etc… After studying someone, I can recognize them almost instantly, as long as they are not aware that they are being observed.
          BTW, I am enjoying the monetary debate between you and Matthew, immensely. Monetary actions, planning, and survivability are ideas that I am fairly new to, so I am enjoying the education. philo, you are an interesting person, with thought provoking ideas. You put your thoughts together in very interesting ways. I always enjoy reading Matthew’s responses, as his mind is so far superior to my own. As I, and many others have said, this forum has provided for us a fantastic opportunity to learn and grow from the knowledge and experience of others, of which I include you. Keep it up.
          Best to you

          • On April 23, 2012 at 11:46 am,
            philo says:

            If you give a crap about actual solutions and your sick of legalized fraud happening in every building we call a “bank”, I suggest you visit the links I’ve given and read everything on these sites to begin to understand what’s going on in reality. Yes, I try to stick to one point at a time because it’s obvious to me that people are talking incessantly and not saying anything.

          • On April 23, 2012 at 1:04 pm,
            Matthew says:

            thesophist, I wouldn’t assume that my mind is superior. We all have our strengths. Sounds like you were a detective or profiler? If so, it would be fun to see your blunt assessment of some of us here -even if we feel “roasted” afterward!

            philo, not “every” bank deserves your disdain. Local and regional banks are captives of the central banks, which aren’t banks at all. Unsound practices are forced from the top, down. The small banks must go along or close.
            Most who comment here are well aware of the legalized fraud. Many are also aware that the best way to effect sweeping change is by individual action, which is motivated by understanding (education), not by the demands of others. Imagine if everyone understood. Who, then, would be left to enforce what no one agrees with? Who would hold T-bonds and dollars over gold and silver? Nothing but ignorance precludes people from making the right decision. This is why I’ve commented here that this system stands on ignorance alone. Without the support of the masses, it would collapse.

          • On April 23, 2012 at 2:59 pm,
            philo says:

            Why would anyone who doesn’t know that banking is pure fraud open a bank? Is there a banker that doesn’t know the game is rigged? You know they have to put on a big show to get away with what they’re doing, right? Besides, you’re not even clear on what they’re doing, otherwise you’d have a clue as to the real solution to it is.

          • On April 23, 2012 at 4:04 pm,
            philo says:

            Let me put it this way, if you sell a house, the dollars in your checking account that you got for the sale are the deed to the house. They are half of the debt instrument and the promissory obligation to the bank is the other half of the debt instrument. You don’t want the house though or you wouldn’t have sold it. Notice I didn’t say “trade for it”. You want what the seller of the house is going to produce. They bank didn’t have debt instruments(dollars) before the borrower went there. You are the lender. You don’t care about getting interest because you have liquidity. You can easily transfer the debt. The debt YOU are in – on the positive $ side. The borrower is on the negative $ side. The banker lives off the usury from the borrower producing stuff and giving it to him when he produces nothing but bookkeeping services. He gets away with this because he always has a huge vault of gold in case people think a “gold standard” is going to change anything. If you lend a piece of paper that’s already a debt instrument(dollar) with a promissory obligation corresponding to it at a bank already, that would be very stupid if you actually did anything to earn that dollar. You would be really gambling in an economy someone else is controlling. Bankers don’t gamble.

          • On April 23, 2012 at 7:30 pm,
            Matthew says:

            I am perfectly clear on what the banks are doing. This why debt should not be allowed to circulate as money. All paper money is a bill of credit. Whether it is a promise to pay a fixed amount of gold, or a promise to pay another bill of credit of the same face value (the current system). Both are an IOU. Both open the door to deception, but the former is infinitely better that the latter. Gold itself IS money. It’s time for people like you everywhere to re-learn that fact and demand that it be recognized as such by those who rule by deception and secrecy. Why would anyone accept debt for the payment of debt in the first place? You cannot extinguish debt with more debt. So, again, we see that this system stands on the people’s ignorance.

            “There is a distinction between a ‘debt discharged’ and a debt ‘paid’. When discharged, the debt still exists though divested of it’s charter as a legal obligation during the operation of the discharge, something of the original vitality of the debt continues to exist, which may be transfered, even though the transferee takes it subject to it’s disability incident to the discharge.” — Stanek vs. White, 172 Minn.390, 215 N.W. 784

            Remember that the first thing dictators do when they rise to power is outlaw the private ownership of gold. Hitler, Lenin, and Mussolini did it. Oh yeah, and FDR.

            “All the perplexities, confusion and distresses in America arise not from defects in the constitution or confederation, nor from want of honor or virtue, as much from downright ignorance of the nature of coin, credit, and circulation.”
            – John Adams

          • On April 23, 2012 at 7:33 pm,
            Matthew says:

            By the way, banks do not need (or have) “huge vaults of gold” to get away with what they do.

          • On April 23, 2012 at 11:10 pm,
            thesophist says:

            Hi Matthew,
            Thank you for your kind response. OK, the ‘roast’, hmmmm, not sure if I’d really want to do that. It’s the Karma principle I’m worried about. In the past when I’ve gone after someone to ‘take them to task’, even if it’s just been in sarcastic fun(as Don Rickle’s used to do) it seems that within a couple of days of that incident something really embarrasing usually happens to me. I’ve gotten a little ‘gun-shy’ about doing that. I think it has something to do with the ‘sowing and reaping” idea. As to my background, I worked with the criminal element for over 20 years. While I am not certified,(well, maybe I am) I have had training in investigation technique and abnormal psych. And the rest just comes naturally. I think I’d better leave the ‘roasting’ to the real professionals, JerryO^OTB and irishtony. 🙂

          • On April 23, 2012 at 11:18 pm,
            philo says:

            Debt is extinguished when the borrower sells something to the lender – the guy with money in his checking account who writes the borrower a check for a product or service, then the borrower takes the check and makes a payment to the bank at which point the money doesn’t exist anymore. Debt is created when a borrower goes to a banker to facilitate a loan(debt). The borrower signs a promissory obligation for 100k for example, and the banker credits the lenders account – the lender is the guy who sells(not trades) the house. Money was just created. I know this is probably very confusing to you because your conditioned to parrot things like “You cannot extinguish debt with more debt”. The borrower also sells a bunch of stuff to the banker to get dollars to give back to the banker(usury) when the banker didn’t have any dollars in the first place and still doesn’t because the debt was extinguished and if all debt is extinguished there would be no money. He did have a limit to how many dollars he could create depending on whether it’s time for a boom or bust. You are just stuck thinking we can’t create a cash supply(debt) that no parasite is facilitating. Community currencies all over. It can be done on a national scale. Colonial scrip was probably a good example until the bankers counterfeited a bunch of it so they could take over. John Adams was one of those guy’s that believed an “illumined elite” should be guiding the course of mankind – stupid. But, then again, he couldn’t really go up against the biggest mob on the planet at the time – no internet. You have no idea how much gold is in the vaults of the biggest mob on the planet.

          • On April 24, 2012 at 7:59 am,
            Matthew says:

            I hate to tell you this, but you haven’t said anything new or noteworthy. When I asked why anyone would accept debt for payment of a debt, it should have been clear to you that I was referring to participants in the real economy. The fact remains that the liability is only transferred from one party to another in this system.
            It should be common knowledge that, due to the pyramiding of debt with interest, there is never enough money at any given time to satisfy all the debt. This is why the system is not sustainable. It requires exponential debt growth in order to function.

            Your cluelessness and gullibility are on full display when you hold out more paper as the solution to a paper problem.
            Money should not just be a claim on something of value (a debt); it should have value itself. It is strange that this concept somehow threatens you. Your confusion plays right into the hands of those you so oppose.

            Ultimately, the market should be allowed to decide for itself, without interference from bankers OR politicians. Since your “solution” still involves centralized control, it might interest you to know that even Karl Marx knew that ‎“Although gold and silver are not by nature money, money is by nature gold and silver.”

          • On April 24, 2012 at 10:16 am,
            philo says:

            We have a private entity with a monopoly on the facilitation of cash so we know we don’t live in a free market. But, we insist that people that work the hardest(sweat), and are the poorest, are that way because it’s a free market. And we have rampant poverty and welfare recipients because it’s a free market. We seem to believe that if there isn’t a huge disparity in standard of living, things just won’t get done. Will things just not be invented and produced if the promise of living better than everyone else is not the motivation of the inventor/entrepreneur? Would it not be rewarding enough to be paid to think as opposed to working a production line? Would anyone work a production line once they realized they were conditioned to believe they’re dumb from the day they were born and only the most aggressive of us end up in management and executive positions? I’ve spent a lot of time thinking while working on a production line. I also spent a lot of that time listening to very wealthy people on the radio(like Rush Limbaugh) talk about nothing for hours. There just simply needs to be an accounting tool like dollars in order to facilitate the creation of stock(private ownership) and the pooling of resources in a modern venture economy that produces new stuff every day. Currency, liquidity. We would need to produce weaponry for the defense against banker controlled nations, unlike the Native Americans did. There will always be people making various wages for their time, but does there have to be such a huge disparity, poverty and unemployment? Is not the current system just a way of fooling everyone that they’re keeping a large percentage, at least, of what they earn in an open free market, when in fact the richest of us don’t earn(produce) anything? And they’re insane and have an agenda that seems to include killing the majority of the population without killing themselves? I personally have to see if things would get done if a public bookkeeper was facilitating the cash supply before I conclude things won’t and we have to eliminate the IOU. Or, I could just plug myself back into the matrix. You notice how what I say sounds a lot like Karl Marx, but I’m not talking about a central bank, a gold standard, a progressive tax and abolishment of private property? Is it possible he was a propagandist working for the communist bankers/industrialists that took over Russia after the Bolshevik revolution? And in fact we live on a giant commune with a scientific cabal as the dictator? And there isn’t a book on the true nature of duplicitous propaganda? What would a free market look like?

          • On April 24, 2012 at 11:13 am,
            philo says:

            I guess if every dollar was a physical bill, and they are owned by a private entity loaning them out with usury, I am calling for the abolishment of that private property.
            1. Abolition of property in land and application of all rents of land to public purposes. – The public cash supply is being rented out by a private entity.
            2. A heavy progressive or graduated tax. – All it takes is a progressive tax period to create the controlled opposition R vs. D Communist Party USA.
            Karl was a funny guy.

          • On April 24, 2012 at 11:28 am,
            Matthew says:

            As you probably already know, Limbaugh, like so many similar cardboard cutouts, is a shill. Corporatists like him and his FOX counterparts masquerade as proponents of free markets but really hate competition. They do not want a level playing field. They do not want market forces (supply/demand) to set the price of anything. In a free market with a level playing field, monopolies are very unlikely. Notice that the corporate takeover of “Main Street” accelerated dramatically AFTER the dollar became a pure fiat currency. From auto parts and fast food to gas stations and department stores, big chains have taken over. Since Nixon removed the last of the dollar’s gold backing in 1971, the gap between CEO pay and worker pay has jumped from 25 times to as high as 525 times -depending on the source. Two income-earners are now likely to make less than a single earner with a high school diploma 50 years ago (in real terms of course). Pro athletes and movie stars have also seen their pay keep up with inflation. The masses could not have been so deceived had the dollar remained fixed to something of value. The current system allows for phantom raises year after year. So most people cannot detect that, net of currency debasement, they are actually getting a pay CUT year after year. A revolt would have come very quickly if only people could SEE.

            Your speculation on Karl Marx could easily be the case.

      • On June 15, 2012 at 11:02 pm,
        Dafi says:

        Reply to Objection 1: God gives to each one according to the prsopue for which He has chosen him. And since Christ as man was predestinated and chosen to be “predestinated the Son of God in power … of sanctification” (Romans 1:4), it was proper to Him to have such a fullness of grace that it overflowed from Him into all, according to John 1:16: “Of His fullness we have all received.” Whereas the Blessed Virgin Mary received such a fullness of grace that she was nearest of all to the Author of grace; so that she received within her Him Who is full of all grace; and by bringing Him forth, she, in a manner, dispensed grace to all.i could post thousands on this one but let those few one be enough.

  7. On April 21, 2012 at 10:12 am,
    Vortex says:

    Vortex’s Daily Snippet (Opinion)

    “Mining equities and future prospect’s”

    Dear Big Al and all dedicated Korelinites world-wide, the investing landscape has never been more laden with dangerous minefields and vast swaths of investing quicksand. More specifically, the unloved, misunderstood and disrespected gold and silver mining equities have to be at the forefront of the ugly duckling syndrome we battered and bruised precious metals aficionados have suffered through. In some instances, the feelings of dispare that reside deep inside of our collective soul’s evolves into down right “hate” as it relates to this volatile and manipulated sector.

    The varying levels of disdain and outright revulsion at the thought of investing one’s difficult to save and hard to come by ever shrinking dollars into mining stocks is a dilemma most of us confront daily in our thirst to find the magic potion that will help us reach the other side of the “grand monetary default” and the abject poverty that awaits the unprepared.

    The Malthusian order and the socially engineered circumstances that encapsulate our faltering monetary system, deliberately debased national currency, two-tier social structure, and financial lawlessness gone wild have left the investing public in a state of frenzied distrust. Seeking answers to questions resembling looking into a black-hole of nothingness.

    The Reluctant Flip-flop Theory

    Interestingly after years of suffering through a declining sector such as gold and silver mining adventures our first thought is to just throw our hands up in the air, give up and walk away. I can fully relate to those thought’s and have had them myself a few times.

    Nevertheless, one must take a step back and constantly analyze the investing landscape and realize that the sun shines on every dog eventually. I have come to the conclusion that the PTB will keep the paper game intact no matter what takes place in the battlefield of the greatest debt deleveraging and subsequent default of the worlds latest economic experiment.

    Therefore my flip-flop and rationale for such a theory.

    As the decreasing values of world-wide currencies succumb to the global central bank printing press’s the inflationary tidal wave will grow leaving little alternative’s but to place one’s bet’s in the monolithic casino of stock markets.

    There is little doubt that gold and silver stock’s and most all commodities will benefit enormously from this currency debasement phenomenon. The reality check that is unfolding before Joe/Jane six-pack will evolve into a feeding frenzy into real resource’s in an attempt to maintain household solvency and live in a chronically dysfunctional world.

    The paper game must go on and the unholy alliance of the monied power brokers will at some point set their sight’s on this tiny sector and exploit, extract, facilitate, fund and expand awareness of the sector. Why, because there are enormous profits to be made and those profit’s are going to be realized.

    The extractive industries such as gold and silver to name just a few is destined to make those with the willpower to stay in the game enough wealth to live easier in a world gone mad as currencies fail and finite resources are openly acknowledged by the masses.


    I an effort to justify such a narrow unscientific theory I could have used fancy charts detailing every concocted theory, gold/silver supply and demand factors, Fibonacci mathematical sequence, kooky star and planet alignment’s as well as a cornucopia of every tool devised by man to make the call.

    None of that is necessary, because in it’s most simplistic form, the mind of man, history and the human herding principle will tell you what the future hold’s. Recording’s through out the ages have given man a mental dictionary to study, detailing strength’s and weakness of human nature in it’s smallest cell structure.

    Man’s lust for money and profits manifested through a desire to attain vast caches of wealth was alive BC and is alive AD. This time it is no different, the mining sector going forward will shine and shine brightly. Physical gold and silver are your ultimate insurance policy and the addition of select mining stocks will help provide that needed natural exponential monetary component to sale through the stormy waters ahead.

    My friend’s stay strong and harness the strength to stay in the game.


    • On April 21, 2012 at 12:17 pm,
      Irishtony says:

      HI VORTEX Great piece which i enjoyed reading, you have great logic , & you express your common sense in plain English. …All i could add is BUY SILVER FOLKS, (physical ) as much as you can afford.

      • On April 21, 2012 at 1:16 pm,
        Vortex says:

        Yes Sir Tony, get that silver. Have a great day.


      • On April 21, 2012 at 1:43 pm,
        Mark Alan says:

        What about bullets & guns?

        • On April 21, 2012 at 2:43 pm,
          Marc says:

          How about a C2 taser – check out http://www.taser.com. I don’t like guns. But, hey, who knows – I might have to better learn to like ’em

          • On April 21, 2012 at 4:01 pm,
            Mark Alan says:

            Don’t feel alone on that, Marc. I don’t own a gun but I have been SERIOUSLY thinking about it. I don’t live in a big city, nor near enough, but I should still consider taking some kind of precaution. I DO know how to use a gun though, all types. I’ve just never really had the urge to buy one….but I am seriously thinking about that.

        • On April 21, 2012 at 2:48 pm,
          Irishtony says:


        • On April 21, 2012 at 6:56 pm,
          John W. Robertson says:

          What about silver bullets?

          • On April 22, 2012 at 5:05 pm,
            Mark Alan says:

            I like silver bullets! It keeps those darn lycanthropes away! You do realize that the bankers are lycanthropes don’t you?

    • On April 21, 2012 at 7:28 pm,
      philo says:

      You know, the owners of the casino never lose.

      • On April 22, 2012 at 12:07 am,
        Irishtony says:

        VERY TRUE.

    • On April 22, 2012 at 2:41 pm,
      Big Al says:

      Great contribution, V!

      Big Al

  8. On April 21, 2012 at 10:24 am,
    Jerry O^OTB says:


  9. On April 21, 2012 at 10:30 am,
    Dennis M. O'Neil says:

    As you await the inevitable.
    It does not hurt to have a little invested in the companies selling the adventerous drills and shovels. Every gold camp has a very profitable hardware store. Not as exciting as searching for “X marks the spot” but in anticipation of inflationary monetary mayhem the margins of the shovel salesman tend to be pretty good!

  10. On April 21, 2012 at 10:32 am,
    Dennis M. O'Neil says:


  11. On April 21, 2012 at 10:36 am,
    Clay says:

    Why is there PM manipulation? My answer is:

    The existing structure and power base of the large corporations, banks, Federal government and its military are interdependent, hence the expansion of the military-industrial complex. This “complex”, depends on maintaining world perception of US strength in its wealth, currency, military, political stability and the ability to coordinate these things for purpose. For example, the Saudi kingdom and Israel are dependent on US protection for their respective sustainability, hence the rulers of these nations will in almost every case defer to the US before acting.

    The US federal government has become entangled in this industrial-military complex while at same time enabling debt as money to maintain and grow the political interdependence between voters and politics, hence the growth of Americans dependent on government spending and entitlements. Gold and Silver are viewed by the Fed, Al points out wisely “the canary in the coalmine”, as potential destabilization of perception in the dollars role both domestically and internationally to maintain the existing wealth of the US and its world power.

    Many recent laws and actions taken by Executive, legislative, judicial and monetary branches of the Federal System have been done to control Americans and foreign nations natural reactions to the problems caused by this entangled web. The Federal system and majority of wealth in the US depends on maintaining the perceived strength of the US both domestically and internationally, hence the support of people like Buffet. However, this entanglement has become too complex to unwind and to complex to continue winding, which is why we see so many exponential curves taking shape such as debt, money supply, commodity prices, derivatives, misdirection of BLS and MSM and even the yearly number of power black outs in the US. So whether a person views the suppression of gold and silver as manipulation or control, it is more important to understand why.

    It is my opinion that this complex system can not be wound up or entangled much longer and will most likely fuse together or be discarded altogether. The most likely trigger for either will be international commerce which moves away from the dollar as settlement in trade as the indebted nations experience decline in their contributions to the worlds economy. Gold and Silver will therefore move to the front as money in the coming world of international commerce, while being subjugated or accepted in the US depending on whether the existing political power systems of the use fuse or are discarded. The fusing of power is tyranny with continual long term decline until eventual collapse, while discarding will be rapid decline followed by rapid renewal. I for one prefer to take the pain all at once in order to avoid suffering a long death, give me liberty or give me death.

    • On April 21, 2012 at 11:34 am,
      Dennis M. O'Neil says:

      Bravo Clay!!!!!!!!!!

      Well done!!!!!!!!!!!
      I for one learn best by listening.
      Below is a link to the text and well produced audio of the historic speech you reference in your post. Take yourself back to St. John’s Church, Richmond, Virginia
      March 23, 1775. Follow the link and click the first audio and read along:


      A comparison can be made to the oppression Henry railed against…. but to be fair it has to be concluded the oppressions we are now subject to are far worse than 1775.

      • On April 21, 2012 at 3:33 pm,
        Clay says:

        Dennis: Thank you and everyone else, this is a group of minds. If two heads think better than on, then multiples of minds approach high degree of both knowledge and understanding. I learn from you and everyone because anything seen into the future is done so when standing on the shoulders of giants.

    • On April 21, 2012 at 12:36 pm,
      Marc says:

      An extremely well-written “executive summary” and analysis of the situation. Just outstanding. The one thing I want to re-emphasize is that if “readers” don’t see anything else – please see and understand this: There is a tsunami coming at the western world at an every increasing rate. That tsunami is gathering more and more power. There are multitudes of “sign posts” being shown to us on macro-geographical/political and economic scales that they are too big to ignore. I think we have discussed these in intense details via this invaluable forum. That tsunami is the relinquishment of ABSOLUTE POWER of the US dollar as the reserve currency of the ENTIRE WORLD. There are a multitude of ramifications to this that I believe most westerners are COMPLETELY clueless about. I will not list them again here….because if you research those on your own – they tend to stick in your brain with a greater “bite” and level of comprehension. Beware, this will be very painful and it will come at you “like a pole shift” would to planet earth. Everything being equal – gold and silver will be at the center of a “new paradigm” of eastern global and geopolitical power and LEVERAGE!
      All the best,
      BTW and PS. Big Al another excellent show and Philo, although a very interesting comment, it won’t score any brownie points or protect you from reality. The Hopi’s are a very spiritual people – but, believe me, they are only human and want to survive also. Working together with others always benefits everyone in the long run. And, unless, you were actually in the meetings personally, it is probably better not to initiate such potentially polarizing comments. Just my humble opinion! The best to you!

      • On April 21, 2012 at 2:45 pm,
        Dennis M. O'Neil says:

        LEVERAGE is the culprit.
        One book I have kept at arms length for dozen years or so is David M. Kennedy’s “Freedom from Fear, The American People in Depression and War, 1929-1945″ although definately not a beach read and certainly not of my favored Austrian School…it is a great source to understand what the broader market and Bernanke might be thinking.
        A couple useful passages: …”extravagantly available credit did not itself cause the boom, just as fuel alone does not cause a fire. Combustion in the financial world , no less than in the physical, requires not only fuel but also oxygen and ignition. No observer has succeeded in pinpointing the spark that set off the roaring conflagration that swept and eventually consumed the securities markets in 1928 and 1929. Clearly, however, its sustaining oxygen was a matter of not only of recondite market mecchanisms and trader’s technicalities but also of simple atmospherics- specifically, the mood of speculative expectation that hung feverishly in the air and induced fantasies of efortless wealth that surpassed dreams of avarice.” 37
        And from the next page
        38 ” For two more gastly weeks stock prices continued to plummet freely down the same celestial voids through which they had recently and so wonderously ascended. The stark truth was now revealed that LEVERAGE WORKED TWO WAYS.” (emphasis added).
        Point of the post…
        Buy into sectors for which explanations are lenghty and
        takes profits when it is unpopular to do so.

      • On April 22, 2012 at 7:09 am,
        philo says:

        I’m not trying to score any brownie points. I’m already the heir to an infinite kingdom. And this isn’t reality.

        • On April 22, 2012 at 8:46 am,
          Dennis M. O'Neil says:

          Your monetary view is understood.
          Your well reasoned and argued premises are however dislocated from a sound conclusion. Your argument reminds me of Bill Stills and Sen Joe Lieberman.
          Mr. Stills because your views are similar.
          Mr . Lieberman because he once gave a great speech lambasting then President William Jefferson Clinton for his obvious crimes and failure to abide by his oath however concluded his remarks only calling for censure.
          Both are akin to giving a warning to a fox who you hire to guard your hen house.
          Honest money is the answer. It may be the proverbial tortoise v. the hare.
          But in the long run the tortoise will win out. I think you and Bill Still are one rung on the ladder from where I am. Both rungs are vast improvements on where we are currently.

          • On April 22, 2012 at 12:17 pm,
            philo says:

            My approach to monetary reform is actually vastly different than Still’s. He thinks money can be spent into circulation. This demonstrates a severe lack of understanding the physics of money. I didn’t know Lieberman had an opinion on monetary reform.

    • On April 22, 2012 at 2:48 pm,
      Big Al says:

      Oh yah, Clay. A big BRAVO!

      Big Al

    • On April 24, 2012 at 7:32 am,
      castanheiro says:

      Hi Clay,
      Let me echo what Dennis said. Bravo!!!!
      Excellent analysis!!

  12. On April 21, 2012 at 12:19 pm,
    Dennis M. O'Neil says:

    Gold Manipulation and Overhead Resistance.

    The gold Manipulation Topic made me think of a post I made on the HL Yahoo board 8/28/11 then referenced as Overhead Resistance which I paste below:

    Remember that Eric Arthur Blair aka George Orwell studied the French Revolution and it was the irony of the havoc caused by the members of the Committee of Public Safety that likely brought him to the idea of double speak. What should we now think of Homeland Security? Below is my previous post…I offer it to show that manipulation can take many forms.
    One form of manipulation not often enough (and not much if at all discussed in today’s first 1/2 of the show) is the tender laws. When your preferred corrupt medium of exchange is challenged you make it the only acceptable currency. You encourage it’s use with overhead coercions…
    Which then led me to post this….to wit:

    “There is no Volcker solution to this monetary mayhem.
    Volcker made a ballsy move in an era in which we were still a creditor nation….where our then debt was predominantly domestically owned.
    In a scenario where the Federal Government has become the largest debtor in world history…where states are strangled by too generous pensions and debt burden…..where our largest cities did not take heed of 1970’s NYC….where private citizens are plagued as the TV ad says “in debt up to my eyeballs”…..where housing is at its most leveraged position ever…..and where a further collapse in housing would certainly be the last straw for the banking system…..THERE IS NO VOLCKER SOLUTION TODAY.
    Comparisons to 1980 metal inflation adjusted tops are far too conservative.
    Although there will always be overhead resistance somewhere until the currency destroys itself completely….overhead resistance in the above setting will come by the way of coercion not free markets.
    Think of the Assignat.

    Overhead resistance…… the Guillotine!

    • On April 21, 2012 at 12:37 pm,
      Irishtony says:

      Now thats the type of overhead resistance, i like…..Good piece DENNIS.

      • On April 21, 2012 at 12:44 pm,
        Marc says:

        Ditto that..Irish….ditto!

      • On April 21, 2012 at 1:08 pm,
        Dennis M. O'Neil says:

        I am certain I do not like it!
        Just as a Roman citizen would be repulsed by a crucifix…a symbol I now embrace.
        I am certain Irish you meant “like” in a just context……as I have learned much from your posts.
        In relation to this and Clay’s post I must say…..at sometime…..your hand is called…
        are you bluffing?…..are the words of liberty we spout backed by sacrifice?
        It is this ultimate dilemma that faces us.
        Do we succumb to a normalcy bias for our selfish interests?
        Or do we distance ourselves from comfort and possibly our own longevity to embrace freedom as our legacy. Our heirs will not embrace our current selfishness.
        For our legacy to have any respect in a free thinking future we must place our own self interest at peril.

        • On April 21, 2012 at 3:03 pm,
          Irishtony says:

          HELLO DENNIS….No i am not bluffing,. WE need to sacrifice what we have today, to protect the future, so we leave something better to those who come after us . WE HAVE A MORAL OBLIGATION.

          • On April 21, 2012 at 3:41 pm,
            Dennis M. O'Neil says:

            I completely understand.
            And I understood as much.
            My point is that you can embrace and respect the utility of a tool while at the same time not wanting to see it in prevalent use.
            Localities across the country have snow plowing budgets due to the mild winter can now be used for other things.
            It is as if Bastiat’s shopkeeper’s window was never broken.
            I am prepared as you….. but I would rather be golfing as compared to glazing a shopkeeper’s window.

  13. On April 21, 2012 at 12:33 pm,
    Irishtony says:

    HELLO CLAY. I have to agree with your last sentence , I too would pre -fare if the whole system were to collapse tomorrow, yes i know it would be horrendous for most people, & would last for a few years, but would that not be better, than seen our descendants locked into slavery to infinity.

  14. On April 21, 2012 at 3:50 pm,
    Clay says:

    Strange is it not that those on this page and many like us are choosing to become aware of the same problems that plagued the founders of our country. True things are much different, instead of King George and his tyrannical court we face similar tyranny from Imperial executive and congress. There is opposition and again it is starting in the States. How it turns out, don’t know, but perhaps some clue comes from the many differences between then and now of which there are many.

    • On April 21, 2012 at 5:35 pm,
      Dennis M. O'Neil says:

      The Sons of Liberty met at Liberty Tavern and drank pints under the shade of an elm tree – The Tree of Liberty. I find it coincidence as Gresham’s Law turned our once Liberty embossed silver coinage into hoards in the mid to late sixties and as Nixon divorced our currency completely from gold that a plague ravaged Northern US States. Dutch elm disease. A couple certain differences between then and now is our purses are lighter now and we would be hard pressed to find shade under a stately Elm.

  15. On April 21, 2012 at 5:58 pm,
    wyn harter says:




    • On April 21, 2012 at 7:20 pm,
      clay says:

      WYN: Yep, I feel the same way you do. So the big question is, how far will they go to protect their empire? All the way of course, but for you and me the time frame is critical, just another equation going exponential and in this case it is insanity.

      Consider this, their goal is to force everyone into Dollars even if it means dropping an Iron curtain around the country and making gold and silver illegal to own and have. The US in this case would be just like North Korea, despite the suffering and deaths to make it this way. It won’t last of course, but it could for several generations during which the free world conquers space, time, a cure for all cancers and discovers free energy, meanwhile Americans live in a medieval dark age.

      Watch what happens tomorrow in the French elections and then follow closely for two weeks up to the final runoff. I think from this we can judge the empires strength and success in forcing its will on the French. The European Union is a Witches stew, something only a devil could drink and joy.

      • On April 22, 2012 at 10:11 am,
        Marc says:

        Thanks for the Chris Martenson interview with Harvey Organ – I really, really enjoyed it…HE REALLY has it nailed! I follow Chris periodically. Excuse me for my ignorance, but I was not aware of Harvey. He seems like a really competent, well informed guy. Thanks again for the great link! I COMPLETELY AGREE _ DEFAULT AND REVALUE GOLD! That is where we are headed – I agree, Spain will be the “acid test” for what is ahead of us!
        All the best,

    • On April 21, 2012 at 9:22 pm,
      Marc says:

      You know, Wyn, I read this about 4 hours ago and I was kinda senseless for a few moments. I had to go watch a movie and think about it! My conclusion is that I think it can only last until China, India and the Eastern behemoth has put all their ‘ducks in a row”. They ‘own” us for now. But, if th Fed,JPM, et al can speak Chinese and “run” the Yuan and dominate global trade to infinity then your scenario will play out. Their “catastrophe” includes some three billion people that SAY: “TIMES UP”!!!
      That’s my thought!

      • On April 21, 2012 at 9:46 pm,
        Marc says:

        I think Dr. Berry’s interview above and the content (and his morning notes summary) contained therein provide much more compelling arguments of an “over ride” of the big boys perceived power.

      • On February 2, 2014 at 11:39 am,
        Usman says:

        Un peu tard pour le tester : l anne9e srocaile s approche de son terme ! Nos maeetres nous aidaient e0 connaeetre la nature (promenades, reconnaissance des arbres, des plantes, pique-nique), avant de nous accompagner, pour la ce9le9bration du 14 juillet : rassemblement, par classe(s), dans la cour de l e9cole, corte8ge gagnant la place, pour rejoindre le corte8ge officiel, devant la mairie. Pre9ce9de9s par la fanfare, le conseil municipal, les e9coliers, les citoyens, se rendent au monument aux morts, pour de9poser une gerbe. Apre8s la ce9re9monie, pendant que les anciens s e9parpillent dans les cafe9s, nos maeetres nous invitent e0 profiter des grandes vacances. Qui dira la douceur de septembre, la cueillette des trompettes de la mort, des noisettes de nouveaux exercices pour le crayon de Martin.

  16. On April 22, 2012 at 1:36 am,
    gloria says:

    Al, Andrew McGuire would have been perfect for your show.
    Ted Butler is also very knowledgeable.

  17. On April 22, 2012 at 9:06 am,
    Karen says:

    Good morning Al,
    It is my opinion that all markets are manipulated with the purpose of avoiding panic while currencies are being inflated There are no free markets only intervention with the intent to give the illusion of recovery. The government has many tools to stage this illusion from gold manipulation to the plunge protection team for the stock market. All logic has been removed from the system. Just look at the 200 trillion in derivatives held by the big banks.

    • On April 22, 2012 at 9:59 am,
      Clay says:

      Karen: You might want to listen to this interview of Harvey Organ, done by Chris Martenson.


      • On February 2, 2014 at 1:19 am,
        Angela says:

        pense que vous pourrez juger de la spe9cialisation en pre9pa avec un peu plus de recul d ici qeulques anne9es, quand vous aurez inte9gre9 votre e9cole la meilleure possible (he9las, c est effectivement le re9flexe de beaucoup de bons e9tudiants). Quand on est le nez dans guidon, on ne voit pas force9ment ce qu il y a autour de soi.@RobinSur la non-e9quivalence des ECTS, je suis d accord. Sur les changements d organisation entre les anne9es, e7a de9pend des universite9s (toutes les universite9s n ont pas des UFR se9pare9es pour les L1-L2).Pour l ouverture d esprit et le degre9 de culture ge9ne9rale d un e9tudiant en fac , j ai quand meame l impression que vous eates d un optimisme exage9re9. Ce n est pas parce qu on va faire du pluridisciplinaire que les e9tudiants vont miraculeusement acque9rir une grande ouverture d esprit (qui, soyons re9aliste, peut manquer e0 leurs enseignants). Ou alors, vous avez des e9tudiants de fac (et des enseignants) diffe9rents de ce que j observe de mon cf4te9.Sinon, je suis entie8rement d accord avec le message de Elsk.

  18. On April 22, 2012 at 9:59 am,
    Clay says:

    Karen: By the way, your right.

    • On April 22, 2012 at 11:18 am,
      Karen says:

      Hi Clay,
      Thanks for the great interview. Really proves that the purpose of the CFTC is to help with the manipulation by ignoring the rules they put in place. Another interesting item is how the Pan Asian Gold Exchange which would have ended the paper game was brought to a sudden halt.

  19. On April 22, 2012 at 10:54 am,
    Dennis M. O'Neil says:

    I agree!
    I think your 200 trillion figure may be a bit low.
    There was a well sourced zero-hedge article had just 5 banks at the 250 trillon level over 6 months ago.
    I also reference you to FSN recent interview with Chris Whalen.
    Interesting take away is recent Bankruptcy reform provide derivatives preference over other creditors. So off book liabilities will supercede those on the books.
    Over utilizing derivatives and credit default sawps to control short term risk creates the certainty of long term chaos. This is why the banks wrote bankruptcy reform the way they did…do not think they did not write it. Chris Dodd and Barney Frank were just taken to dinner. It is all akin to a finacial Tower of Babble with a weak foundation.
    At some point Tiger will come running in and the Brady Bunch House of cards will come crashing down in all directions.

  20. On April 22, 2012 at 11:40 am,
    Karen says:

    Hi Dennis,
    great interview with Chris Whalen. Yes, the and banks are still writing derivative rules for their benefit. I think one or two have cleared committee.

  21. On April 22, 2012 at 11:55 am,
    Mark Alan says:

    Now THIS should make you go hhhhhmmmmmm….


    • On April 22, 2012 at 6:34 pm,
      Dennis M. O'Neil says:

      He was just a Wal-Mart Greeter on Vacation.
      He did not like plastic and he hated Traveler’s Checks.

      I kind of would like to know why they were seized.
      What is wrong with walking around with a few billion?
      Haven’t they ever seen Al Sharpton leave the house on an election day in Harlem?

      What if they say his billions are forged….think about it the next time a cashier marks up a bill you present for payment.
      The government has other ways to repudiate.
      Inflation is despised. What about when they cancel all bills whose last serial numeric is #4. What about when they call in all the green notes for exchange for blue.
      What about when the only acceptable payment is a biometric.

      The poor Wal-Mart greeter was just on vacation and wanted to see The Vatican.

  22. On April 22, 2012 at 8:00 pm,
    Mark Alan says:

    Well if he was just a poor Wal-mart Greeter, then maybe I should go apply at Wally World so I can get my hands on certificates like that!

    • On June 14, 2012 at 11:40 am,
      Meral says:

      Aw, Bill, you’re too kind. The poem I wrote late in my senior year at Branaddeis was rellay just a bit of melanadcholy prose designed to lift my ideadaladisadtic spiradits and to peradsuade WVBF’s Loren & Wally to give me a trip for 2 around the world. It worked on both accounts. It went: “I wonadder if paint still rains on Italadian canadvas, if Shakeadspeare and Dickadens linger in London’s fog. Before I can live, I have to breathe.” That’s twenty-five words or less on why I wanted to go around the world, and next to “Weladcome to Trashadtown,” the best thing I evera0wrote.

  23. On April 24, 2012 at 8:56 am,
    Irishtony says:

    HELLO..thesophist…”ROASTING” I’m still trying to work out , if you were paying JERRY & I a compliment,…or just been sarastic…haha……………..MATTHEW & PHILO….Great debate, i really enjoyed it……….Problem is i am even more confused now….not sure who’s side to take. Might just flip a coin…..haha.

    • On April 24, 2012 at 10:22 am,
      castanheiro says:

      Hi Mr. Irishtony,
      It was a compliment indeed. “Roasting” is a form of comedy, where someone is, for lack of a better term, “lampooned” or playfully made fun of, in a funny, non harmless way, for a good laugh. Kind of like ‘poking fun at someone’, making a joke out of their idiosyncracies, foibles, faux pas, etc… It’s difficult to do and be funny. I would not be capable of it, that’s why I passed it on to you and Jerry, the real comedic pros. It was indeed meant to be complimentary.
      Best to you and good health, my Irish buddy!!

  24. On April 24, 2012 at 1:12 pm,
    Irishtony says:

    castanheiro…Hello & thank you explaining the meaning of “ROASTING”, it’s just that, over here it mean’s chucking a piece of a dead animal into an oven (hot ) & then eating it…….. we are very weird over here haha

    • On April 24, 2012 at 1:17 pm,
      Matthew says:

      But dead, roasted animals are YUMMY! Mmmmm. Guess I’m weird too.

      • On April 24, 2012 at 10:20 pm,
        castanheiro says:

        Hello Irishtony and Matthew,
        I like the dead animals roasted in the hot oven too. That’s why i joined PETA, “People Eating Tasty Animals” Mmmm, Mmmm, good!!

  25. On June 22, 2013 at 6:47 am,
    http://www.kristahoward.com says:

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