Weekend Show – Sat 31 May, 2014

Welfare, the VA situation, Edward Snowden and a possible cancer breakthrough

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Al KorelinCory FleckDan OliverPeter GrandichGlen DownsBill Howald
Jeff DeistRick AckermanChris TempleJay TaylorRichard Postma
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  1. On May 31, 2014 at 1:15 am,
    Lawrence says:

    Thanks Al and Cory,

    Jay Taylor and Peter Grandich are always my favorite speakers. Even though I am not very interested in US politics but I feel I must know.

    Since I am able to make the first poster, I like to make a few best guesses based on theory of market intervention:

    1. US stock market will suffer a major correction before October. After the correction, it will go much higher and top out in next two years.

    2. Gold, especially silver, will make a low later next month and start rising from there. It will surpass the old high in the next two years by a wide margin.

    3. Inflation will become obvious and people will start noticing it.

    4. Pension funds will collapse in the next 10 years.

    • On May 31, 2014 at 5:18 am,
      Irwin says:

      Will you please come back and repost the above in two years?
      Thank you

      • On May 31, 2014 at 7:41 am,
        Lawrence says:

        I put it down on my calender

        • On May 31, 2014 at 3:21 pm,
          Dennis M. O'Neil says:

          In two years I hope to be systematically rotating my food pantry.
          Anything but the above who cares about Lawrence’s 1-4.
          BTW the public pension recipient is the most likely to toss a Molotov Cocktail.
          Look at the Athen’s bank in which 4 workers were toasted by disgruntled public workers. The scenes of Madison Wisconsin will be tame in light of those that were promised so much finding they were duped.

      • On May 31, 2014 at 3:49 pm,
        CFS says:

        You think 10 years is optimistic?

        • On May 31, 2014 at 4:11 pm,
          Lawrence says:

          10 years is short for pension funds. Hope not shorter than that. Otherwise we will see suffering. Actually some pension funds are in some trouble already. Our provincial public service pension fund and a few others already cancelled the option of being able to retire at age 55 if age plus years of employment is above 85. The funding rate is down to ~76%. 24% is missing!!! There is no money to be made with current interest rate and people are collecting money. The premium has grown from 10% to 17% . People are complaining.

          Back to my old country, people take a differeent approach. My father’s pension fund changes the distribution model and result in 30% less pension. Those pensioners just sit in city government and said if you don’t give us our old pension back, we just sit here untill we die. City had to reverse the decision.

  2. On May 31, 2014 at 1:26 am,
    Robski says:

    On Snowden, I really don’t know what to think about him. I would like to believe that is a patriot, but I’m not sure he is a CIA plant. Remember Catch-22?


    The one thing I’ve learned through life is magic is just like politics, everything is based in misdirection.

    • On May 31, 2014 at 2:32 am,
      Andrew de Berry (Rev) says:

      Robski – Surely the Catch 22 is the U.S. government itself! For it really stretches credulity beyond belief to suggest that Snowden might be a Russian agent!!And let’s just consider Sec of State John Kerry for a moment. Kerry accuses Snowden for being a ‘traitor’ as well as a ‘coward’ for not ‘manning up’ to return to the U.S. where he’ll be given a fair trial. The reality is that were he foolish enough to return he’d be given immediate life detention without any trial. Left to vanish without trace in other words.
      Greg Hunter makes the point, if it needs making, that how can someone who exposes the NSA for intruding on everyone’s blogs or emails (including Angele Merkel) be ever branded a traitor? Given that Snowden is only telling truths now universally acknowledged THAT’S where we’ve got the Catch 22! Snowden is no more than a hugely courageous whistle-blower, and who by his own admission can now ‘sleep well at night’. More so when bankers such as BNP Paribas get fined $10 billion for ‘doing business’ aka money laundering with such terrorist nations as the Sudan and Iran. And you tell me why Kerry isn’t pursuing to hell and back bankers such as at Paribas who should be criminally prosecuted, or more to the point charged with treason?

      • On May 31, 2014 at 5:58 am,
        Birdman says:

        Actually Rev, I always thought Snowden was a plant whose mission it was to send a message that would cow and intimidate the public, media and most especially those in opposition politics who were not cooperative. If that is correct then it was executed sublimely and with brilliance because there is not a person in ten thousand who doubts Snowdon is telling the truth. All they do after coming to that conclusion is take sides over whether he is a traitor or not rather than question if he is even telling the truth!

        • On May 31, 2014 at 9:13 am,
          Big Al says:

          I believe that he is telling the truth.

      • On May 31, 2014 at 7:51 am,
        Lawrence says:

        Considering he tried to political asylum in China. Considering China was still in a good term with US at the time, it is quite risky strategy. Why not run to Russia directly? I think he is just a idealist?

      • On May 31, 2014 at 9:11 am,
        Big Al says:

        You heard Jeff’s opinion about Kerry!

    • On May 31, 2014 at 9:07 am,
      Big Al says:

      Thanks Lawrence, that II s certainly possible.

      I think that the major stock market correction will definitely happen. Basic fundamentals are definitely not driving this movie and fictional situations always end.

      Lawrence, my rationale as stated above also cause me to agree with your predictions about gold and silver with the following exception:

      Contrary to what critics think and accuse me of, I am not short term in : my thinking and so I can’t agree or disagree with your timeframe.

      Inflation? Probably

      Pension funds? Definitely

    • On May 31, 2014 at 9:09 am,
      Big Al says:

      I think Robski that he could very well be a man with a.conscious? Is it a misdirected conscious? Heck, I don’t know enough about espionage to have an opinion!

  3. On May 31, 2014 at 1:34 am,
    Robski says:

    Another thing about Snowden, how naive is he that trust NBC? If I was in position, I would have made sure that the FULL interview would of been available online for all to see. To trust a media outlet to publish the truth on the interview, ie no bias, is a fools errand.

    • On May 31, 2014 at 2:34 am,
      Andrew de Berry (Rev) says:

      Perhaps that’s what makes Snowden more plausible still, namely that he’s ‘gullible’ in a way that decent folk often are.

      • On May 31, 2014 at 9:14 am,
        Big Al says:

        Perhaps, Reverend!

    • On May 31, 2014 at 5:47 am,
      Jay says:

      RE: EDWARD SNOWDEN. Must watch!!
      posted this a week ago but if you missed it, great to see a piece like this in the mainstream!!


      • On May 31, 2014 at 8:13 am,
        Andrew de Berry (Rev) says:

        The thing about conspiracy theorists getting in on such as the Snowden bandwagon is that their conspiracies grow even more preposterous than the original event. That said, I can go along with the conspiratorial murders of JFK, Princess Diana or that 9/11as Snowden makes out was known about long in advance. But as for Snowden being some sort of double agent for me that’s got to be way OTT. Come on in all you other folks out there. You must have a view on this!

        • On May 31, 2014 at 9:16 am,
          Big Al says:

          Double agent Reverend? I really don’t think so!

          • On May 31, 2014 at 9:36 am,
            Andrew de Berry (Rev) says:

            Nor me Al!!

          • On May 31, 2014 at 7:33 pm,
            Jay says:

            Well said Andrew. agree fully!
            AL, love your comments at the end of the first hour i believe! almost paraphrasing the great Mark Twain who said “Loyalty to the country always, loyalty to the government when it deserves it” 😉

          • On June 1, 2014 at 1:33 pm,
            Big Al says:

            And that was exactly my point!

  4. On May 31, 2014 at 4:12 am,
    Birdman says:

    I am having a big problem reconciling the poverty statistics and the millions of people who receive food stamps (because hunger in America is apparently rampant in conjunction with obesity being out of control) with this new set of data showing that welfare pays more than typical salaries in up to 33 states. OK? There is a huge disconnect here. Somebody is obviously lying or manipulating data to suit an agenda. We hear on the one hand that up to 60% of the population is living paycheck to paycheck and that half of all Americans don’t even have 2000 dollars set aside for a rainy day. Then in the next breathe we are told welfare and social assistance benefits in Hawaii can be as high as 60,000 dollars annually. Am I just being bullshitted here or what? What is the truth. Are Americans starving or are they just pigging out on a free lunch provided by state and federal agencies while crying the poverty blues? I said last month that it is my opinion food stamp programs are one of the biggest frauds in the economy. No GD way in hell do 100 million citizens of the US need up to a thousand a month for food or they will go hungry. I have seen the food bank programs up in Canada and it is just drug addicts, alcohilics and welfare bums participating. Jesus man, I could pull my hair out. Where I live people often get by on just one meager meal a day and trust me it is really a basic meal of beans or rice or bread. No Lobster that’s for damned sure.

    • On May 31, 2014 at 4:27 am,
      J........the Long.............ootb says:

      Bird…….one problem that you might have is that you might not have been around the USA for the last few years………Everyone expects someone to give them something for free. Everyone in America expects to live like a King or Queen at someone else’s expense. After all we do have an interstate highway system called a FREEWAY. Kids start out with a system of FREE LUNCH OR FREE RIDE on the bus. The kids do not even have to walk a 1/4 of a mile to school. We have trained up a child to expect FREE, with someone else to pay. We do not have poverty, but, poverty THINKING. Thinking someone else is going to take care of everything, like Big Daddy Govt.

      • On May 31, 2014 at 4:56 am,
        Andrew de Berry (Rev) says:

        J Here we have poverty along the same lines of welfare dependence. But today’s poverty is different from the 30s, more so with yesterday’s luxury becoming today’s ‘apparent’ necessity – flat screen TVs, smart phones, cars.
        Poverty in the 30s terrible as it was was more of the make do and mend variety, and where at least there was some sort of barter system – folks still growing their spuds, etc with others repairing shoes or whatever. Today most folks grow their veg out of a supermarket trolley, throwing away anything that has reached its meaningless sale-by date. On top of which everything else is throwaway, leaving poor folks largely bereft of what made the old poverty that much more bearable, namely their greater resourcefulness.

        • On May 31, 2014 at 5:14 am,
          Birdman says:

          Excellent comment Reverend!

          • On May 31, 2014 at 9:19 am,
            Big Al says:

            I second that Bird!

      • On May 31, 2014 at 4:57 am,
        Birdman says:

        Nothing is free. How about free speech? Does it apply to that?

      • On May 31, 2014 at 7:33 am,
        Matt says:

        When your govt prints ‘free’ money,charges the world to do it and then steals the natural resources and controls internal politics through the threat/use of force on a global scale it is easy to see how some may become confused when thinking everything is ‘free’. Free for the international bankers as long as those Americans keep the game rolling.

        • On May 31, 2014 at 9:20 am,
          Big Al says:

          Good and thought provoking comment Matt!

      • On May 31, 2014 at 9:18 am,
        Big Al says:

        Good point Jerry

    • On May 31, 2014 at 5:01 am,
      Andrew de Berry (Rev) says:

      Not saying it’s true Birdman but water retention is known to make some starving Africans ‘obese’. I’ve heard of fat Americans who swear blind that even after a prolonged diet (forced or otherwise) they cannot reduce their body mass.

      • On May 31, 2014 at 5:21 am,
        Birdman says:

        I have not seen starving Africans except on TV Reverend. Here though there is what we call a nourishment problem in that calories per day are generally insufficient and the variety of local foods is far from satisfactory. Too many rely on very simple repetitive diets without the choices we all take for granted back home so they often don’t get enough essential vitamins and minerals. The other thing is that protein consumption is incredibly low. The stuff that is needed to make brains and bones and muscle grow strong seem to always be too expensive to acquire. Like milk and meat and cheese and eggs for example. It is changing though and the middle class is on the rise so they are now demanding the foods for their children that their own parents could never afford.

        • On May 31, 2014 at 9:23 am,
          Big Al says:

          Save me from looking it up Bird. What is the average life span in Kenya?

          • On May 31, 2014 at 10:07 am,
            Birdman says:

            Al, off the top of my head I think it is 55 these days. Over in Ethiopia it was as low as 49 a few years back. Poor nutrition and medical care play a big role. Insufficient access to good dental care is another. Road accidents are absolutely epic. They never seem to be minor. There are hardly any preventative programs like in the West either and then there is the issues with malaria, yellow fever and other mosquito borne disease. The list goes on and on. Basically it is dangerous as hell to live here if you are poor and cannot afford basic medication just for starters.

          • On May 31, 2014 at 10:51 am,
            Big Al says:

            Thanks Bird.

    • On May 31, 2014 at 9:17 am,
      Big Al says:

      I personally believe the numbers Bird

      • On May 31, 2014 at 10:29 am,
        CFS says:

        And the US EPA banned DDT or we would have eradicated mosquitos by now.

        • On May 31, 2014 at 10:55 am,
          Big Al says:

          That would certainly anger the mosquito rights activists!

  5. On May 31, 2014 at 4:20 am,
    Birdman says:

    Excellent comments Doc. All of them.

  6. On May 31, 2014 at 5:21 am,
    Andrew de Berry (Rev) says:

    ‘The bond market is a joke, the stock market is a joke. That’s pretty much worldwide. And those responsible for ruining financial markets and economics – namely the world’s central banks – are held in high esteem. Go figure.’ Bill Fleckenstein. While Mitch Feierstein of ‘Planet Ponzi’ warns that global unrest is drawing ever closer with gold about to soar. Both guys see the maniacal rise in stocks, bonds being once the former collapses being mirrored in an equally maniacal rise in PMs.

    • On May 31, 2014 at 8:02 am,
      Lawrence says:

      I cannot see bond collapses until $ nosedives

      • On May 31, 2014 at 8:14 am,
        Andrew de Berry (Rev) says:

        Which it will Lawrence. Who knows tail end of this year?

        • On May 31, 2014 at 9:40 am,
          Andrew de Berry (Rev) says:

          Stock market should have tanked 0n 29/5 (Q1 GDP -1%). And gold should have soared but it slipped 0.2%. Still got gold’s silly season during the summer.

          • On May 31, 2014 at 9:46 am,
            Big Al says:

            Agree Reverend!

  7. On May 31, 2014 at 5:29 am,
    Steven says:

    The rise of gold and silver to full 100 cents on the dollar will if left to politically correct rigged market forces always be 2 years in the future day after day . In other words those that run the markets will never allow any meaning full rise in the metals.
    So lets shed sham, pretense and delusion and recognize that owners and producers must abandon the market and decide for themselves what they want for their property and charge accordingly.

  8. On May 31, 2014 at 5:31 am,
    RGT says:

    Inflation or deflation?
    It’s crystal clear these days that the Fed is manipulating everything so I contend that if we really did have a deflation threat or the fed was worried about it wouldn’t they be pushing up precious metals and all other commodities to counter it rather than constantly crashing these sectors and holding them down?

    • On May 31, 2014 at 7:04 am,
      roboman says:

      “Inflation is when you pay fifteen dollars for the ten-dollar haircut you used to get for five dollars when you had hair.” –Sam Ewing

      INFLATION IS THE LEAST APPRECIATED PHENOMENON TODAY (April 30, 2014): If you were to poll ten thousand investors about what is most likely to occur in the worldwide economy during the upcoming twelve to fifteen months, then rising inflationary expectations would probably be among the least popular responses. However, evidence demonstrates that there has already been the kind of behavior which typifies a period of global reflation. Commodities from coffee to corn to limes to palladium to soybeans have been surging in recent months, while gasoline (petrol) prices recently climbed to 13-month highs. Each of these so far has been attributed to a separate localized reason rather than the unifying theme of rising prices, but eventually these will be recognized as part of a related theme. Rents have been steadily rising in the U.S. and around the world, while wages have been increasing at their fastest pace since before the last recession as unemployment especially among skilled workers has declined to a sufficiently low point where there is a shortage of qualified candidates in many fields and particularly in certain specialties.

      The U.S. Federal Reserve appears to be obsessed with the risk of deflation, while being unconcerned about the possibility of rising prices. Because the Fed wants higher U.S. housing prices, the usually inflation-wary Fed is likely to continue to be especially accommodative toward allowing inflation to move higher especially if this helps to keep unemployment low. The Fed giving the green light to rising prices is especially dangerous, since history has demonstrated that once inflation appears it will become quite challenging to suppress. The shares of companies which benefit from rising inflationary expectations, including most emerging-market equities and commodity producers, had mostly bottomed at five-year lows at various points from June 2013 through March 2014 and have begun what could become dramatic uptrends as they revisit their respective peak levels from 2013, 2012, and 2011, in that order.


      • On May 31, 2014 at 9:30 am,
        Big Al says:

        Bottom line – more dollars chasing the same amount of or fewer amounts of goods!

        • On May 31, 2014 at 11:06 am,
          Birdman says:

          The problem with that popular definition of inflation though is that there are not shortages to justify higher prices and thus there is not genuine inflation. The dollars are in surplus but so are the goods. Secondly we already have too much of everything inside our own homes as an outcome of past consumption. None of us is really exposed to situations where we cannot get what we need at the right price. It is why I noted some time ago that the only way to drive inflation in the developed countries was by pressuring supply. How else can you get normal demand to push prices? And so we see both food and energy can be driven higher by conflict in Ukraine as one example or by droughts in California as another. During the Great Depression there were programs to eliminate hogs, chickens and crops in order to stimulate pricing. Farmers were paid not to plant for example and wholesale slaughters of good herds of pigs and cattle were carried out in Canada to reduce the amount of production. Totally insane of course but it was tried.

          • On May 31, 2014 at 11:29 am,
            Big Al says:

            Interesting concept Bird

          • On June 1, 2014 at 5:50 am,
            Steven says:

            That sounds like a early version of what is going on now. Market manipulation by the powers that be and not nessesarily to the benefit of owners or producers.

          • On June 2, 2014 at 9:46 am,
            Matthew says:

            Re: “The problem with that popular definition of inflation though is that there are not shortages to justify higher prices and thus there is not genuine inflation.”

            Completely wrong. Prices adjust based on supply and demand. Shortages are avoided precisely due to this fact! This is why government intervention (i.e. price fixing) is so destructive. Shortages don’t happen in a free market because goods and services are rationed naturally by rising prices. Conversely, excess supply is brought into balance with demand naturally by falling prices.

            Re: “The dollars are in surplus but so are the goods.”
            The (fiat) money supply has grown at a rate far beyond that of any good or service. This imbalance is what ultimately pushes prices higher (asymmetrically of course).

          • On June 2, 2014 at 11:40 am,
            Birdman says:

            We are saying the same thing. My point was that there are not real shortages. For almost everything of importance there is adequate supply. Inflation pressures are thus tame. Notwithstanding, we did go through a period of speculation back in 08 that caused commodities to rise more than genuine demand might have warranted. I do know about the market setting behavior for price. Perhaps I should have given an example or two to be more clear what I was really getting at though. If you are a homeowner or even a long term renter you will relate to this idea easily. How many coffee makers do you have? If you rummage around the house would you find a surplus working microwave, older model TV, spare power bars, somewhat dated cellular phones, three or four can openers of which two are electric etc etc. Those things represent past consumption and during a period of high unemployment and economic stress they threaten future consumption patterns too. We are mostly all blessed with quantities of inventory that goes unloved and unused. So even cheaper prices of new goods might not entice us to buy when we can pull old equipment out and put it back to use if required. Remember cash for clunkers? The whole idea behind that was to destroy old inventory in order to support the auto industry. It was an incredible subsidy for the domestic car makers that was passed off as a way to rid the country of polluting old junkers but most of us could see right through that ruse. Anyway, what I was trying to get at was that the demand we previously brought forward by past buying habits has now become a drag on future consumption and thus limits the conditions of need that might otherwise push prices up and be considered. Too many dollars chasing too few goods, right? Well as you know I live in the developing world and I face shortages every single day. Over here there are very few homes with a duplicate set of anything. People are more careful with their spending and tend to use what they purchased in the past until it is finished before they will buy a replacement. I don’t ever hear of anyone here with more than a couple pair of shoes for example but I can tell you my ex back in Canada easily had more than a hundred pairs! So anyway it easy for me to make the connection between supply and demand and how pricing responds because it is an obvious daily market function. Vehicles are a perfect example. Older autos here often cost almost exactly as much as those that are new. The reason is simply that demand outstrips supply to the extent that old pieces of crap can fetch like new prices because the dealers for new cars all have waiting lists! We also have shortages of sugar, transportation, some grains and a long list of manufactured goods. We go hunting for things that are just not easily available and then there are premiums to be paid once you find them. Well back in Canada and the US I cannot ever in my life recall empty shelves except in stores that were going out of business. The differences are huge. Here we have seen inflation up to 60% not that many years back while you guys struggle with official rates that are a limp two percent if that. And that figure of 60% is average. Depending on what you were buying it could be much, much more. So what is the point? Well in the US, as a result of demographic patterns where disposable income is saved rather than spent and also partly owing to the good fortune of excess supply at almost every turn, it strikes me as unlikely that you will get inflation of the variety driven by genuine shortages. So that is not your worry. You ought to be happy that the system is as stable as it is actually. I will bet you have never had to sit in a lineup for fuel for example. Well over here they line up during the night sometimes and return to their vehicles in the morning or they don’t get any gas at all. That kind of environment drives price. Yours does not.

          • On June 2, 2014 at 11:56 am,
            Matthew says:

            If you can connect the dots, shortages are always the result of some sort of government action(s). You need to look a little harder.

        • On June 2, 2014 at 12:16 pm,
          Birdman says:

          Jesus, you are a stupid man. You know nothing.

          • On June 2, 2014 at 12:19 pm,
            Birdman says:

            And you get a great big fat “zero” for effort (as usual).

          • On June 2, 2014 at 12:48 pm,
            Big Al says:

            Okay,if you stay so.

          • On June 2, 2014 at 4:28 pm,
            Birdman says:

            It is never a conversation with that guy.

    • On May 31, 2014 at 9:27 am,
      Big Al says:

      Did you listen to Rick’ s thoughts?

      We will do an editorial with him on your comment.

      • On May 31, 2014 at 12:49 pm,
        CFS says:

        There recently an unbelievably decision out of the 9th US Circuit Court of Appeals.
        A while ago a grape (for raisins) grower in California had 46% of his crop destroyed by the USDA. He sued and was awarded a judgment for compensation. The USDA appealed and the award of compensation was reversed. The logic of the Appeals Court appeared to be that since the destruction of the farms grapes caused an increase in the price of raisins, the farmer had received compensation via the sale of that part of the farmer’s crop which was not destroyed. (Only in Amerika is that logic.)

        • On May 31, 2014 at 1:57 pm,
          J........the Long.............ootb says:

          wander if the plaintiff had sour grapes after the verdict……….

          • On May 31, 2014 at 2:00 pm,
            J........the Long.............ootb says:

            wonder not wander…

          • On May 31, 2014 at 4:02 pm,
            Skeeta. says:

            Ha ha ha !

          • On May 31, 2014 at 5:31 pm,
            CFS says:

            Gotta pay attention; he did not have any grapes, the USDA took them!

          • On May 31, 2014 at 6:21 pm,
            J........the Long.............ootb says:

            what is the 46%…this is fuzzy math…or fuzzy grapes….

          • On May 31, 2014 at 6:27 pm,
            J........the Long.............ootb says:

            this is raisin a question………

          • On May 31, 2014 at 8:32 pm,
            Skeeta. says:

            …did you hear this story on the grapevine ?

          • On June 1, 2014 at 12:37 pm,
            J........the Long.............ootb says:

            I THINK that was a Marvin Gay song..” I Heard it through the grapevine”..1968

          • On June 1, 2014 at 12:44 pm,
            J........the Long.............ootb says:

            I THINK that was a Marvin Gay song..” I Heard it through the grapevine”..1968
            and I think it is a favorite with Big Al…..

        • On June 1, 2014 at 11:05 am,
          Big Al says:

          Amazing Professor

  9. On May 31, 2014 at 5:34 am,
    Birdman says:

    That Theralase actually sounds like a fascinating. It will be worth watching to see how the human trials go.

    • On May 31, 2014 at 9:30 am,
      Big Al says:

      My thoughts exactly.

  10. On May 31, 2014 at 6:31 am,
    gary says:

    Inflation is always a monetary phenomenon. If we had deflation prices would be collapsing and the dollar would be rocking higher. We won’t get another deflation until inflation rises high enough to collapse the economy. Historically that has come when oil rises 100% or more in a year or less. That is too big of a shock and the economy collapses.


    • On May 31, 2014 at 7:25 am,
      Birdman says:

      Totally wrong Gary! The only reason prices are at current levels is BECAUSE of reflation efforts. Take away that support and we are 1933 again. The fact is that prices WERE collapsing. Stocks tanked, housing did a face plant and the consumer economy was gutted and peeled literally overnight. Near new cars were being sold at half price by desperate home owners and the RV market was asphyxiated as hundreds of thousands sat rotting in parking lots across the country. People were cutting loose yachts in Florida and trying to claim they were stolen just to get free of the payments. Others burned their homes for insurance rather than face bankruptcy as housing went flaccid. So those are signs of a depression. It is what comes before the high inflation that results from policy that finally kicks into gear. But we are still so weak that policy antidotes have dome little more than keep the economy afloat. And now we are heading into the business cycle downturn that I used to talk so often about. That means recession but it will happen from a very weak level so it is unclear how harmful it will be. Housing is again resuming its path downward and it is inevitable that stocks will correct sharply (even catastrophically) sometime in the not too distant future. Is that not more deflation in your books? People worry for good reason. Why do you think bonds are so strong with those kinds of concerns? I really don’t get your logic at all because it misses the obvious. We have all this crap still coming down the pipe and we have done almost nothing about delevering either the public or private economy debt loads which is what swamped our boats in the first place.

      • On May 31, 2014 at 8:14 am,
        Lawrence says:

        Without FED efforts we will get deflation with most people loosing their jobs. However FED has proven to us that it will do whatever it can to inflate the economy to the next collapse. However, in the process inflation is assured. Sadly, I feel this is a current way of thinking in general. We are so powerfull that we will never let natural law to take control. This remind me of communism which lived under for years.

      • On May 31, 2014 at 8:58 am,
        J........the Long.............ootb says:

        Just an added note…….AT zerohedge………”GASOLINE COMSUMPTION DOWN 75%”, since 1998…….the storage tanks are full , all over the country, the economy has been weak for sometime.

        • On May 31, 2014 at 9:35 am,
          Big Al says:

          Not sure I believe that. I will research it. Very hard for me to believe.

        • On May 31, 2014 at 10:26 am,
          CFS says:

          Oil storage a month ago was very low. It has increased recently because winter ended.
          Oil consumption, primarily due to increased MPG has decreased some 3 million barrels a day from peak oil consumption, despite increasing population.

          • On May 31, 2014 at 10:53 am,
            Big Al says:

            Thanks Professor

  11. On May 31, 2014 at 6:35 am,
    gary says:

    We won’t collapse into deflation again until commodity inflation spikes just like it did in 2008. Then we will go into the next deflationary period but not until.


    • On May 31, 2014 at 8:38 am,
      Lawrence says:

      Commodities don’t inflate by themselves. Someone is inflating them.

      • On May 31, 2014 at 8:54 am,
        Gary says:

        It is liquidity from the Fed’s printing press and leaking out of overvalued stocks that makes commodities inflate.

        One inescapable law is that liquidity eventually flows out of overvalued assets and into undervalued ones. The process can take time as human nature can push moves much further than one would think possible. That is the case right now with an extremely overvalued stock market. Traders continue to pump money into it for no other reason than it is going up. But some of that liquidity is starting to move to the commodity markets as one by one traders are starting to come to their senses and realize how dangerous the stock market has become. They are beginning to move capital into the undervalued commodity markets and out of the parabolic stock market.

        • On May 31, 2014 at 9:00 am,
          Lawrence says:

          OK we are talking about the same thing

        • On May 31, 2014 at 11:35 pm,
          Birdman says:

          “It is liquidity from the Fed’s printing press and leaking out of overvalued stocks that makes commodities inflate”. — Gary Savage

          That cannot be true at this time, Gary. We do not have direct evidence of that being the case anyway. In fact different commodities have been moving for different reasons as another poster here noted yesterday. Gold on the other hand, which is the barometer of monetary expansion, is in outright decline. Lets look at some others….

          Beef: Herds in the US and elsewhere have been in decline as farmers retire so there is demographics at play. This is happening even as demand for beef in the developing world is on the rise.

          Crude: War is the answer. Demand is down and supplies are growing yet prices will not relax as long as conflicts and the threat of war in the Middle East and Eastern Europe keep brewing. The advent of potentially serious conflicts arising in the China Seas over resource rights will likely also play a role in the future as will the expected supply disruptions to shipping if a shooting war actually breaks out.

          Pork: The recent disease outbreak has seriously impacted the industry and resulted in significant losses of piglets. Supply is now constrained and thus prices are up.

          Wheat and Corn: Tight supplies around the world coupled with severe droughts in some regions and the advent of conflict in Ukraine have seen prices rise since early in the year.

          Uranium: Serious supply crunch is coming. This is due in part to the end to past agreements whereby US and European buyers were consuming enriched material out of old Soviet warheads. Then we had mine closures due to low prices following Fukishima. Meanwhile, a huge expansion of reactors is underway right across thee world and there is simply insufficient supply to meet demand going forward.

          Copper: It’s use as a carry trade and as collateral for business and property loans in China has kept prices buoyant recently as buying there continued unabated despite a drop off in construction. In the past it was outright hoarding of copper in Asia that kept prices afloat. So we see price stability in the Doctor despite a globally slowing economy and it has sent a mixed message to investors who can no longer rely on its price signals to inform them of market conditions that might otherwise suggest an end to past expansions resulting from interventionist policy.

          Platinum and Palladium: Increased consumption from automakers has eaten into falling supply. Mine closures due to strikes in South Africa has resulted in lower production. Potential conflict with Russia creates conditions for instability that has resulted in investors bidding up prices as there is the suggestion US sanctions may result in supply restrictions issued out of Russia.

          Coffee: Drought has played a big role here as Brazilian production has taken a big hit. At the same time coffee consumption is on the rise in much of Asia and the developing countries.

          I could go on and on. What is interesting is that each commodity has its own narrative for why it has been on the rise. The common theme here is supply disruptions or reduced production although conflict and war are also playing a role. So it is the supply side of the equation that has been impacted prices rather than demand driven by a global expansion.

          None of these reasons though are suggestive of capital migration from stock markets into resources because of monetary interventions but rather speculative opportunities that are developing on a case by case basis.

          We note that the rising trend in resources is not playing out in the gold and silver markets and that in itself puts your theory into doubt. So I cannot agree with your assertion that “Fed printing press liquidity” is at the heart of the recovery in some commodities. When we see all commodities rising in the major currencies I might side with you more as it will then be obvious that inflation has finally broken out globally

          • On June 1, 2014 at 4:54 am,
            gary says:

            One can rationalize whatever reason they want for why prices are rising. It all boils down to valuation. Liquidity eventually flows out of overvalued assets and into undervalued ones. There is never any exceptions to this rule. Human emotions can stretch the process out far longer than one would think as we tend to chase rising prices but eventually capital will come out of overvalued markets and go into undervalued ones.

            I think that process is just starting to happen with the CRB breaking it’s three year down trend. It will continue until stocks top and roll over which will send a flood of money into the commodity markets which will then collapse the global economy and trigger the next deflationary episode.

          • On June 1, 2014 at 6:15 am,
            Birdman says:

            Get a grip Gary. You obviously have no idea what usually happens to commodities following a stock market crash. Have you checked any charts of how they perform when there is an economic collapse? Let me give you a hint. Demand for everything declines abruptly. You are simply delusional. I can appreciate someone who colors outside the lines but in this case you are creating a narrative so flawed it has now become a waste of my time to talk about this anymore.

          • On June 1, 2014 at 1:40 pm,
            Big Al says:

            Interesting commentary Bird. Thank you.

  12. On May 31, 2014 at 6:40 am,
    gary says:
  13. On May 31, 2014 at 6:42 am,
    Cedarstrand says:

    we have deflation in what we own and inflation in what we need

    • On May 31, 2014 at 9:36 am,
      Big Al says:

      Interesting comment Cedarstrand

  14. On May 31, 2014 at 6:47 am,
    roboman says:

    Another great show. A brief comment below from Kaplan about the news media. For the record I am also a True Contrarian.

    Whenever the financial markets are undergoing an important transition, this critical passage will be masked by the media’s irrational attention to minor news events which are reported as though they were earth-shaking events. Because most investors don’t pay attention to what is happening, they aren’t interested in nuances of intraday extremes, divergences, insider activity, or fund flows. Instead, they want to trade in the direction of previous trends because they have been brainwashed into believing that they will continue indefinitely. Whenever the media feature a particular financial event, investors will be reminded that they have been tardy in jumping aboard the bandwagon, and will foolishly act just as it has become maximally dangerous because a trend reversal is either imminent or has already begun.


    • On May 31, 2014 at 9:37 am,
      Big Al says:

      Thanks Roboman!

  15. On May 31, 2014 at 8:37 am,
    Francis Murphy says:

    You’re right AL about Grandich’s compassion and Grandich is right about its fine to help but there needs to be a cut-off date.

    • On May 31, 2014 at 9:39 am,
      Big Al says:

      You mean help others by teaching them how to fish?

      • On May 31, 2014 at 10:14 am,
        Birdman says:

        No Al…by throwing a few overboard so they learn how to swim first!

        • On May 31, 2014 at 10:52 am,
          Big Al says:


          • On May 31, 2014 at 1:40 pm,
            CFS says:

            You might not believe this:

            DAYTONA BEACH — A husband and wife who’ve been feeding the homeless and other needy people in a city park for a year are no longer allowed there after police cited them for illegally feeding a crowd.

            The citations and trespass warnings against Chico and Debbie Jimenez and their volunteers are part of an increased effort by the police to discourage Good Samaritans from steering homeless people away from the agencies set up to provide the same services. It’s part of the city’s and county’s broader effort to eventually centralize homeless services.

            “The ordinance is there, so if we catch you, we’re going to cite you,” Police Chief Mike Chitwood said Thursday. “If you want to feed people, and you want to do a good, Christian act, we encourage you to coordinate with the social service agencies.”

            There’s more in the top cite. PLEASE READ IT.

            Think that is wrong?

            I could cite similar Police crackdowns just this year in:
            Birmingham. Alabama.
            St. Louis, Missouri,
            Rayleigh N.C.
            Philadelphia PA
            and Orlando FL

            Insane bureaucracy and officialdom
            (Although I read a lot, I’m sure I’ve missed many acts of government utter stupidity.

          • On June 1, 2014 at 11:15 am,
            Big Al says:

            That is absolutely insane and scary.

      • On June 1, 2014 at 5:55 am,
        Steven says:

        That only works if the fish are bigger than minnows Al. Insignificant pay rates and variable hours are almost useless unless the price of big ticket items like real estate collapses to insignificant levels. If work really pays relative to the cost of living you will get more of it.

  16. On May 31, 2014 at 8:41 am,
    Gator says:

    Great interview, collapse of the dollar, manipulation, etc.


  17. On May 31, 2014 at 8:54 am,
    Lawrence says:

    I believe that Rickards knows what he is talking about

  18. On May 31, 2014 at 9:05 am,
    Lawrence says:

    Gregory Mannarino says there is no taper and evidences all point to that way. How do we make of it and what we think of our saviour Belgium?


  19. On May 31, 2014 at 9:17 am,
    CFS says:

    Grandich is wrong.

    History has demonstrated that anything other than minimum (keep from starvation level help) does nothing but lead to reduced growth of economic development in a country.
    Welfare, given in the form of cash handouts is less beneficial than in-kind handouts.

    e.g. two buildings away from a library I visit often in England is a betting shop which I have to walk by in order to get to the library. They both happen to open at 9 a.m..
    Standing outside the betting shop, first thing, there are always people I know live in Council housing (city-owned low income subsidized housing).
    How often have you been in a grocery line and seen people buying cigarettes with food stamp (cards). I know it is supposedly not allowed, but neighborhood shops in the US do not enforce that law for customers they recognize.
    As a person who has donated my time, labor and occasionally hard cash to charitable organizations to provide clothing and meals to poorer members of society and given even to provide free and subsidized educational trips for the children of the poor, I do not believe Government involvement is cost-effective.
    Michelle Obama’s involvement in determining school lunch menus is the height of stupidity.
    Meddling, simply because she can.

    • On May 31, 2014 at 9:41 am,
      Big Al says:

      Kathy and I strongly only support organization that teach people how to fish.

  20. On May 31, 2014 at 9:26 am,
    Gary says:
  21. On May 31, 2014 at 9:32 am,
    Paul L says:

    I don’t see how those high welfare rates can be so high. Here is what I found but these much lower rates are still too high (higher than min.wage):
    Top 10 Hourly Wage Equivalent Welfare States in U.S.
    State Hourly Wage Equivalent
    Hawaii $17.50
    Alaska $15.48
    Massachusetts $14.66
    Connecticut $14.23
    Washington, D.C. $13.99
    New York $13.13
    New Jersey $12.55
    Rhode Island $12.55
    California $11.59
    Virginia $11.11
    From dept of commerce.

    • On May 31, 2014 at 9:44 am,
      Big Al says:

      A person can use statistics to say whatever they want. Your point is well l taken. Regardless of the actual number, it is still l too high!

    • On May 31, 2014 at 10:24 am,
      Birdman says:

      It is how they add up all the benefits that makes the numbers so high, Paul. For example, if you are on welfare you will qualify for subsidized housing, Snap benefits, free medical and dental care, childcare assistance, drug plans, free eyesglasses, transportation passes or tickets, special taxis if you are disabled, addiction treatment programs, annual clothing and shoe allowances, discounts at certain business’s and even relief from taxes, fines, fees and penalties at the municipal level. That is just for starters as the programs are so widespread they encompass virtually every aspect of daily life. But you must be on welfare or other Veterans programs to qualify.

      • On May 31, 2014 at 12:56 pm,
        CFS says:

        The amazing thing is the number of individual programs the Federal government has with incredible inefficiency of overlap of bureaucracy and redundancy of administration. Only in the US could non-zero-base budgeting create such waste. No program is ever scrapped, just new ones added, it seems.

        • On May 31, 2014 at 1:43 pm,
          Birdman says:

          Agree CFS. It is utterly beyond the realm of belief. Nobody needs to work until the system actually breaks under the weight one day. Maybe that explains all the hollow point bullets. They will be fighting angry, hateful, entitled, welfare lunatics armed with little more than knowledge of Justin Beibers lifestyle habits and boxes of stale Twinkies plus a whole lot of attitude. It is going to be a freaking disaster.

          • On June 1, 2014 at 11:17 am,
            Big Al says:

            The future certainly has that potential.

  22. On May 31, 2014 at 9:49 am,
    Bob UK says:

    Interesting purchases of 8 million GDX shares and 1.2 million GDXJ shares just before the bell yesterday.

    • On May 31, 2014 at 10:25 am,
      Birdman says:

      Thanks Bob. That is interesting to me.

    • On May 31, 2014 at 10:44 am,
      Big Al says:

      Did not realize that. Thanks Bob.

    • On May 31, 2014 at 11:12 am,
      RICHARD says:

      Good comment. I believe it’s foreshadowing when you look at the weekly volume of GDXJ since the end of December. In fact the weekly chart looks even better then the weekly chart of the PM itself. The volumes are huge considering last year. It’s often said that increasing volumes mark the top and bottom of various asset markets.

    • On May 31, 2014 at 2:07 pm,
      bb says:

      Gold was climbing back up at the end of the day, did somebody sell the rally?

  23. On May 31, 2014 at 9:56 am,
    Bobby says:

    Warren backs up my opinion of where gold and silver could go.
    Interesting how charts can be seen differently by different chartists!

  24. On May 31, 2014 at 10:07 am,
    PF says:

    John Williams is full of baloney. How many times has he been wrong with his hyperinflation and $$ collapse predictions?

    • On May 31, 2014 at 10:50 am,
      Big Al says:

      I have to disagree. He brings out truths that many are unaware of. Remember, no one is always correct.

  25. On May 31, 2014 at 11:06 am,
    RICHARD says:

    I feel compelled to make a comment. After reading a number of the comments today, I’m impressed with the thoughtfulness of many of them. Some of the ideas expressed; I’ve not considered before especially concerning Snowden. The comments seem to reveal thoughts that go beyond just regurgitating what has been expressed in other media outlets—–I find many of them fascinating.

    • On May 31, 2014 at 11:30 am,
      Big Al says:

      That’s what we are all about Richard.

      Thank you,

      Big Al

    • On May 31, 2014 at 11:46 am,
      irishtony says:

      RICHARD…….There are a lot of very clever, free thinkers visiting this site everyday. That’s why I never miss at least one daily visit….Of all the sites I visit , this is MY favourite……..Remember blinkers are for horses…& this site is not a stable……….
      Well done all you clever people.

      • On June 1, 2014 at 10:54 am,
        Big Al says:

        Thanks Mr Irish,

        My friend you are so correct!

        Best to ya

  26. On May 31, 2014 at 11:34 am,
    bb says:

    seg 3. Funny, John Stewert discussed this a couple nights ago.
    He showed a long list of videos of polititians claiming just how much they appreciate veterans how they intend to “care” for them etc. All lies. Going back years.
    I think what has to be accepted is it is obvious now there is no intention of caring for veterans.

    The way I see it is only enough to prevent riots will be done.
    As americans are entirely ignorant there is a lot of leeway yet.

    As Corey says, pumping money into the stock market doesn’t really help the “common” man. My thinking, there is no intention to help the “common” man.
    The market is mearly used as a tool for the illusion.

    We have to remember and understand that the American government has started more than 80% of wars since WW 2 killing more than 30 million people.
    This is not the conduct of people that “care” for people.

    These are the actions of psychopaths, I feel its time to stop thinking there is any reason to expect actions that are not consistant with psychopathy.

    Lets face it, to fund VA requirments isn’t all they have to do is print money?

    • On June 1, 2014 at 10:50 am,
      Big Al says:


      So what can be done about all this?

      • On June 1, 2014 at 12:53 pm,
        bb says:

        The only thing I can see that can be done is for a person to educate himself enough to understand how to protect himself and family.
        What will happen (if history or logics is any guide) is the system will collapse, hopefully we don’t kill too many people on the way down.

        But, things could be done, unfortunately people don’t care enough to do them.
        For example, there have been machines designed that positioned properly would clean the oceans. See any billionares or govenments or group of millionares building them?
        We have the technology to build automobiles that run on solar, see any govenments or bilionars buiding them?
        Every car could be sold with a system to recharge it nightly via solar.
        Sold anywhere? nope, gotta plugem in.
        Where is Oprah if she really gives a hoot? Where is Branson,Faber,Rogers,the churches the temples or synigoges etc etc
        These are just a couple of examples.

        But these examples show that people don’t care enough to do anything, surely they have the intillect to know they could.

        So, the system will collapse and the only thing a person can do is learn to protect themselves. Give what help you can to those around you.
        As far as I can see that’s all a person can do.

  27. On May 31, 2014 at 11:46 am,
    Irwin says:

    GSR interviews BOB HOYE – May 28, 2014
    37 minutes

    Last minute summary:
    > stocks and bonds topping in months ahead
    > sets the stage for USD rally
    > and maybe bottom for gold and silver

    • On May 31, 2014 at 1:36 pm,
      Birdman says:

      Fantastic interview Irwin. Thanks for posting it.

    • On June 1, 2014 at 10:52 am,
      Big Al says:

      He certainly is not alone in his thinking.

  28. On May 31, 2014 at 12:08 pm,
    cecilhenry says:

    A boomer walked into my office and complained about the fees, insisted they were too much, demanded I charge less (because he’s retired now) and complained that the government should do something because I charge so much.

    After all, maybe you shouldn’t have retired so soon or took so many trips to Costa Rica.

    But NO. HE has a problem and brother I OWE him for the problem,or else he’ll sick the Government on me.

    Fed up with the parasites that are Government and all that benefit but dont pay.


    Nobody’s flooding Africa with Non-Africans and giving them free health care, affirmative action and special privileges.

    Only White Countries are doing it, only White children are affected, and only White politicians are allowing it.

    Anti-racist is a code word for anti-white.

    • On May 31, 2014 at 12:16 pm,
      Birdman says:

      Jesus Cecil….you posted that like ten times already. Got it out of your system yet?

      • On May 31, 2014 at 4:29 pm,
        cecilhenry says:

        Too damn important. And by the way, if you reflect a little the same could be said for you. But that;s hardly the point now is it.

        • On June 1, 2014 at 11:34 am,
          Big Al says:


          Here is what I think the crux of the issue really is.

          How many people would really wasn’t to go and live in Africa, China, Japan, the Philippines or where ever? Life is simply too good in the United States. That is the bottom line. Do we make it too easy? Of course the govt does and that increasingly does not include “us”.

          Are the people who benefit from this easy to control?

          Yes, and that is what is concerning to me!

          • On June 1, 2014 at 7:13 pm,
            Birdman says:

            True enough. There are not many foreigners over here. I rarely see any unless I am in one of the better hotels for lunch. Except for the Mormons. Those guys are everywhere. They were even recruiting in Israel of all places. Good luck with that!

    • On June 1, 2014 at 11:02 am,
      Big Al says:

      You have said this before and we understand.

    • On June 2, 2014 at 4:49 am,
      Steven says:

      Yes indeed Cecil it is only in White countries where whites are being replaced by others through immigration and hung out to twist in the wind by those that look like us but have no loyalty to us. ( pink rabbits) Low pay, high real estate prices, abortion, immigration, feminism,homosexuality, excessive government and continuous wars. Call it what it is.
      Call it anti white genocide.

      • On June 2, 2014 at 2:08 pm,
        Big Al says:

        Some would not agree with you Steven, but I kinda do!

  29. On May 31, 2014 at 12:36 pm,
    PastExpiryDotCom says:

    Regarding Kerry saying “Man up” to Snowden:

    “On the surface, it seems like an odd thing to say, especially to someone who voluntarily burned down a fairly comfortably life to flee into exile. Right or wrong, it took guts. But it’s the phrase itself, as well as the meaning. Coming back to the United States to face the court system suddenly sounds like a form of bro-ish peer pressure, like something you would chant to a reluctant keg-stand participant, not an announcement from someone in a position of national diplomatic power.”

    Kerry is an idiot.

    • On May 31, 2014 at 1:21 pm,
      bb says:

      Kerry is just another psychopath, he probably understand that a great many people will agree with him.
      Ive met quite a few people that think Snowden is a traitor.

      Makes no sense for him to go back to the states tho, why on earth would he go back just to spend the rest of his life in jail?
      Cant see what that would accomplish.

      • On May 31, 2014 at 3:07 pm,
        Andrew de Berry (Rev) says:

        bb And what about banks laundering money with terrorist nations….see my comment above.

        • On May 31, 2014 at 3:33 pm,
          bb says:

          Yes, banks launder and supply funds to “terrorists”. HSBC launders money for the drug cartels and the Federal Reserve as well.
          People that use the net to inform themselves have known about this for a few years now, really doesn’t look like anything is going to be done about it. I would be surprised if there was.
          Just have to accept that we are corrupt, I doubt if corruption Is reduced in any way, I actually expect it to increase. If that’s possible.

      • On June 1, 2014 at 11:13 am,
        Big Al says:

        The only reason would be to perhaps prove that he loves his country and he acted for the right reasons.

        The reality of that is that he probably would just rot in jail.

        • On June 1, 2014 at 12:59 pm,
          bb says:

          That’s a thought Al, on the other hand didn’t he prove he loved his country already?
          I hope he doesn’t go back, he would end up like Manning, most just forgetting his name.

    • On June 1, 2014 at 11:04 am,
      Big Al says:

      A lot of people certainly feel that way Past

  30. On May 31, 2014 at 1:03 pm,
    CFS says:

    Kerry is a rich idiot.

    • On May 31, 2014 at 3:05 pm,
      Andrew de Berry (Rev) says:

      Totally with the three of you above!

    • On June 1, 2014 at 11:07 am,
      Big Al says:

      He certainly is Professor.

      Interesting comment on our society.

  31. On May 31, 2014 at 1:20 pm,
    CFS says:

    OFF TOPIC: Off Radar:
    Abkhazia, the breakaway region that along with nearby South Ossetia was the main focus of the 2008 war between Russia and Georgia, is today a de facto independent country, although its independence is recognized only by Russia and three other countries and it remains heavily dependent on Russian support. Russian funds are reported to account for 70 percent of the country’s budget in 2012. (Similarities with Ukraine’s unrest makes me question CIA involvement.
    The president of Abkhazia has apparently fled the capital, Sukhumi, after protesters stormed his headquarters. The opposition is reportedly still in control of the building. Claims are noticeably similar to Ukraine. Government corruption, siphoning of money by President., etc.

    • On June 1, 2014 at 11:10 am,
      Big Al says:

      That is really interesting
      Why can’t people just live and let live?

  32. On May 31, 2014 at 1:23 pm,
    CFS says:

    Just more revolting peasants?

  33. On May 31, 2014 at 1:30 pm,
    bb says:

    Speaking of Snowden, I guess he did an interview on nbc last week with Brian Williams.
    Zerohedge has comments about 911 by Snowden that were not aired if anyone is interested.

  34. On May 31, 2014 at 3:51 pm,
    Dennis M. O'Neil says:

    Why is it that the VA issue is treated as being so recent.
    We have skewed our vets forever….aka Bonus Army.
    What about “Coming Home”?:]]]]]

  35. On May 31, 2014 at 7:16 pm,
    CFS says:
    • On June 1, 2014 at 1:31 pm,
      Big Al says:

      We paid for our girls’ educations courtesy of an investment in a water company. Twenty five cents to five bucks.

  36. On May 31, 2014 at 9:36 pm,
    Silverbug Dave says:

    Hmmmm not much mention of gold here anymore – I wonder why… doesn’t anybody mention gold anymore…

    • On May 31, 2014 at 11:56 pm,
      Andrew de Berry (Rev) says:

      I do Silverbug. It’s just that three years of patience wears a bit thin and we need to consider all the landmarks before gold’s rise. Helps PM enthusiasts to keep the faith!

      • On June 1, 2014 at 1:43 pm,
        Big Al says:

        I have to repeat again Reverend. Who cares as it is all about time frame. My opinion anyway. To me the price is kind of irrelevant.

    • On June 1, 2014 at 12:09 am,
      Birdman says:

      I feel certain that gold will be hitting on last Decembers lows before the next month is out. We should see a test of support by mid June at the latest. There are substantial reasons for investors to want to lighten up on precious metals prior to announcements by the ECB that could see the Euro weakened and therefore result in a rising dollar trend. I think the risks here strongly outweigh the opportunities. Mr Draghi has been unequivocal. There will be initiatives announced at the June 5 meeting although how strong they are is still an open question. Personally, I would not want to be long gold on that date. Confirming that view is that once a negative trend such as we are now seeing in gold has been established it grows increasingly likely that a retest of past lows will come into play. It is obvious to me that the market is now pricing in a strong dollar and indeed it has just broken 80.50 sending a major signal that it will continue to appreciate and thus harm any good prospects that gold might have had. What gold actually does on Monday morning is another issue altogether. It could easily rise leading into June 5 and that might not be a big surprise but I would want to be short that date as policy will surely trump fundamentals. Just my opinion Silverbug. Hope the gold comments don’t discourage you too much but this summer is going to be a bummer for the PM’s!

      • On June 1, 2014 at 2:31 am,
        Birdman says:

        By the way, it is my belief that as a result of the recent sharp declines in gold and silver that Monday will bring short covering. This will result in prices rising Monday and Tuesday which will then draw selling on the bounce. Thursday could see another sharp down day. I was having trouble thinking through the outcomes when I wrote on Friday but sometimes the weekend gives you time to clear up ideas in your head. I have no position now in any case but my instincts tell me that it is best to keep clear except for the most short term of trades.

        • On June 1, 2014 at 2:53 am,
          Bobby says:

          Bird, read trader Dan s comment in my post below.

          • On June 1, 2014 at 3:09 am,
            Birdman says:

            Thanks for the link Bobby. I always appreciate Dan’s viewpoint. As it stands I agree with him. The bear market in metals continues. At the minimum we will triple bottom. Actually I strongly suspect it will get worse based on my projections for the dollar trade. In all probability the ECB actions will come in stages through to the fall keeping pressure up and sending gold to lows below 1190.

      • On June 1, 2014 at 3:01 am,
        Birdman says:

        And just a last note….it has become clear to me that currencies are what is moving gold at this time. That has been my suspicion for some time now. All the theory that we have heard about Ukraine and conflict there has made no appreciable difference as far as I can see. The largest recent moves have coincided with the action of the dollar/euro pair and various comments from the ECB. So lets keep that in mind. Furthermore, the drop in bond yield has signaled very low expectations of inflation and I think this is also playing a supporting role in why metals cannot take flight as so many keep telling us. As long as these conditions keep the pressure up there are not any good reasons to be optimistic about the metals trades despite the cacophony of voices insisting we are near a critical bottom that is about to explode to the upside. Lets just say I have my doubts. Bullish sentiments in the die-hard camp are far too high still and this has affected the thinking of Hedge Funds and other money looking for good strategic bets. I now think they will be disappointed for the balance of the year at the minimum and that taking long positions will lead to more an exercise in frustration and waiting that showing stellar profits. I am not even trying to be a wet blanket but as the dollar goes into a rising trend I highly doubt gold will see benefits.

        • On June 1, 2014 at 2:23 pm,
          Big Al says:

          Everyone has an opinion – let’s see who is right.

          • On June 1, 2014 at 5:55 pm,
            Birdman says:

            An opinion? Funny Al. There is not an opinion out there that I trust more than my own.

          • On June 1, 2014 at 9:04 pm,
            Big Al says:

            Smart man Bird!

          • On June 1, 2014 at 6:31 pm,
            Birdman says:

            When I turn out to have called this correctly (again) I might just insist you mention it on your show Al!

          • On June 1, 2014 at 9:07 pm,
            Big Al says:

            Happy to Bird!

  37. On June 1, 2014 at 12:09 am,
    Andrew de Berry (Rev) says:

    Last night Carl Froch (36) knocked out fellow Brit and super-middleweight George Groves (25). Groves is a sublimely gifted fighter but it was Froch who saved ‘his best punch ever’ right up to what could be the grand finale of his boxing career. Don’t know what parallels you can draw from this but maybe the one about ‘keeping your head when all about you others are losing theirs’.

    • On June 1, 2014 at 7:18 am,
      Dick Tracy says:

      Andrew, for me it all boils down to knowing when to act decisively in life given the resources you have, timing is probably the most important and governing factor in life.

      • On June 1, 2014 at 7:26 am,
        Dick Tracy says:

        I might also add that without money you have very few options and then timing becomes paramount.

      • On June 1, 2014 at 2:32 pm,
        Big Al says:

        Yes it definitely is Machine Gun!

    • On June 1, 2014 at 1:48 pm,
      Big Al says:

      Of course, always keep your head and not feed your head as Grace Slick advised.

  38. On June 1, 2014 at 1:03 am,
    Allan Mountain says:

    re Jay Taylor’s comment in segment.

    100% correct. Same dynamics apply in all the other Anglo-American nations.

    We are all in for a very rough ride. Hopefully the people will wake up and demand change before it is too late to do so and we find ourselves in ensnared in a fascist dictatorship with no possible means to effect change through the ballot box.

    Great show guys. Thank You.

    • On June 1, 2014 at 9:50 am,
      bb says:

      its already here Allan.

    • On June 1, 2014 at 1:55 pm,
      Big Al says:

      Thanks Allan

  39. On June 1, 2014 at 2:20 am,
    Bobby says:

    Wondering what became of trader Dan? He on the other side, warning of the “spinners”.

  40. On June 1, 2014 at 2:51 am,
    Bobby says:
    • On June 1, 2014 at 2:13 pm,
      Big Al says:

      I read it start to finish Bobby.

  41. On June 1, 2014 at 6:00 am,
    Tom says:

    Wow keep it simple stupids…inflation is an INCREASE OF THE MONEY SUPPLY…rising prices are a symptom…rising prices are here and they will get a lot worse…End of discussion.

    • On June 1, 2014 at 6:53 am,
      Birdman says:

      Then why is gold falling in price, Tom? And please don’t say manipulation.

      • On June 1, 2014 at 11:05 am,
        CFS says:

        Now who is in denial?

        • On June 1, 2014 at 11:06 am,
          Birdman says:

          Denial about what?

          • On June 1, 2014 at 6:22 pm,
            CFS says:


          • On June 1, 2014 at 6:46 pm,
            Birdman says:

            You believe that poppycock?

      • On June 1, 2014 at 11:28 am,
        Tom says:

        Ummmm it’s already been proven…it’s so blatant it’s embarrassing…they don’t even try and hide it.

      • On June 1, 2014 at 2:30 pm,
        Big Al says:


        To me there is more to I..inflation than gold. Food and energy to name just a couple of things!

  42. On June 1, 2014 at 6:38 am,
    roboman says:

    It’s not the end of the discussion. The debate is not what inflation is, but that the Fed thinks we don’t have much based on data they use. I say Bull crap…..

    • On June 1, 2014 at 2:27 pm,
      Big Al says:

      And I agree Robo

  43. On June 1, 2014 at 7:17 am,
    roboman says:

    For the record I own NO Gold or Silver and only trade the miners short-term. A Contrarian view of the current move down below…..and I’m currently long the miners GDXJ/GDX. We will know in the weeks ahead if the comments below are correct, but for now Birdman is correct and gold is still moving down. NO ONE knows for sure when that will change. I bought this last dip and for now have a gain in my GDXJ trade. The below comment is just an opinion like all the others posted here, but I trade in real-time based on what I think will happen next, and I remain long on my current trade.


    I agree with the comment below.

    “The selloff is almost entirely technically inspired, as momentum players sold and/or sold short after the April 21, 2014 higher lows were broken to the downside. Whenever technical traders are acting as a group to either buy or sell, they are almost always wrong near a major turning point except in the unusual case in which an even larger group of investors would be hurt by their being right–such as in April 2013, when we actually did have a downside breakout for precious metals and their shares because a massive concentration of amateurs who bought near the tops in 2011 hadn’t yet sold and would suffer much more from being forced out than technical traders would gain by selling into the downside breakout. Today, there is no significant group of amateurs who would be hurt by continued losses for gold and silver, because they already bailed out in 2013. In contrast, because there were such huge amateur outflows from precious metals funds last year, many would be harmed by missing out on a dramatic rally. Therefore, today’s technical move was designed solely to ensure that the fewest possible investors will benefit from what will surely be a huge upswing for this entire sector. By the time investors decide to get back in, prices will be enormously higher.”

    • On June 1, 2014 at 12:52 pm,
      J........the Long.............ootb says:

      great post….roboman…………I like the quote… “huge upswing for this entire sector”

  44. On June 1, 2014 at 9:13 am,
    CFS says:

    Today is the start of hurricane season in the Atlantic.
    So the National weather service makes an announcement……
    ending with the words…… But we have to remember the earth is warming up.

    My comment: Fact: The earth is not warming up, you morons.
    Check the damn weather statistics.
    My prediction is that this will be a below average hurricane season.

  45. On June 1, 2014 at 9:18 am,
    CFS says:

    And now for something completely different:

  46. On June 1, 2014 at 9:24 am,
    CFS says:
  47. On June 1, 2014 at 9:53 am,
    CFS says:
    • On June 1, 2014 at 5:58 pm,
      Birdman says:

      How come those KWN soundtracks never play to the end?

      • On June 1, 2014 at 6:27 pm,
        CFS says:

        Because you:
        Use explorer or chrome browser.
        Don’t wait for them to fully load before playing.
        (allow to fully load, including reloading if necessary before playing, if using quicktime)

        • On June 1, 2014 at 6:28 pm,
          CFS says:

          It’s a safari/Mozilla-microsoft interface problem

          • On June 1, 2014 at 6:40 pm,
            Birdman says:

            Hey thanks. Yes actually, I was using Mozilla on that laptop and you are correct I did not wait for it to load all the way. So basically if I try to run it on any other browser it should be OK though. Weird I never had that problem on any other site though. Only KWN.

  48. On June 1, 2014 at 11:03 am,
    CFS says:

    Knowing that the people are against it;
    knowing that Congress will not agree;
    The Big Zero will use the EPA to impose a heavy burden on everyone.

    Such a stupid idea will takeaway the advantage the US now has = cheap energy.


    Tell me The Devil Incarnate is not trying to kill the USA as we know it.
    Because I would hate to think what He could try if he wasn’t trying now.

    I guess he has the War Option still up his sleeve.

  49. On June 1, 2014 at 11:14 am,
    CFS says:


    There they go again; how can the better off win?

    (Joke, Folks)

  50. On June 1, 2014 at 11:21 am,
    CFS says:
  51. On June 1, 2014 at 11:29 am,
    Tom says:

    What’s the best way to short the American markets?

    • On June 1, 2014 at 4:58 pm,
      bb says:

      Tom, check “tsx money”. They have lists of etfs, lots of bears.

  52. On June 1, 2014 at 12:11 pm,
    CFS says:

    Tom, The problem is the stock market no longer correlates with the US economy.

    The US economy can be as dead as a Dodo, but the market will be propped up by money printing and manipulation. I am not sure the market can go down as long as it is being pumped.

    • On June 1, 2014 at 2:40 pm,
      Big Al says:

      Of course I agree with your observation Professor.

  53. On June 1, 2014 at 12:21 pm,
    CFS says:
  54. On June 1, 2014 at 1:43 pm,
    CFS says:

    Does anyone remember back in the Jimmy Carter days, at the time of the Iranian hostage crisis, Carter asked for a law to be passed so hostage trading blackmail was not legal.
    Since then, several laws have been passed penalizing trading and/or aiding terrorists.

    Does anyone know just how many sections of the US Code our leader just broke?

    • On June 1, 2014 at 2:45 pm,
      Big Al says:

      Good question Professor

  55. On June 1, 2014 at 2:33 pm,
    CFS says:

    Post navigation
    Why talk of Fed “tapering” is just talk
    By 247Bull Editor 12 June 2013
    As we noted in our recent precious metals commentary, investors now expect the Federal Reserve to begin reducing its economic stimulus programme at some point in the next few months. This expected reduction in asset purchases, which is being referred to as “tapering”, and whether or not the Fed actually follows through on it largely depends on one question. Can the US economy really stand on its own two feet without support from the central bank?

    Our view is that it cannot and this article examines why that is the case and why talk of “tapering” is just talk.

    Evidence that the US economy is still in poor health

    What follows is some evidence that the US economy is still in poor health……
    If it is not manipulation what is keeping the market up? Enough buying is going on to feed the algos just enough. Smoke and mirrors as the momentum boys push to the cliff.

    The labour force participation rate is currently 63.4%. The last time there were so few people in the workforce was in 1979 when America was experiencing an oil crisis.
    The employment-to-population ratio for adults age 25 to 54 is still 4.5 percentage points less than its pre-recession average.
    Job growth at small businesses is now at about half the level it was at the beginning of the year.
    The BLS reported that in Q1 labor costs fell by 4.3%.
    Wages as a percentage of GDP are hovering near an all-time record low.
    It takes the average unemployed worker two-thirds of a year to find a new job.
    The US is tightening fiscal policy by 3.2% of GDP this year, the biggest squeeze in half a century.
    Thus far consumers have dealt with the burden of higher taxes by reducing their savings rate, which is now at just 2.5% nationally.
    The burden of taxes, rules, regulations and red tape means that the percentage of Americans who are self-employed is now at the lowest level ever recorded.
    Consumer credit is at the highest level ever recorded and is growing at a frightening pace as millions of Americans resort to going into debt to make ends meet.
    47.8 million Americans (15% of the country) are receiving food stamps.
    The May 2013 ISM manufacturing report came in well below expectations at 49 (a number below 50 indicates contraction), the lowest since the depths of the crisis in mid-2009. New orders also fell sharply to 48.8 on weak foreign demand.
    The inventory to sales ratio has hit a level not seen since 2009, meaning that there is a lot of inventory sitting out there that people are not buying.
    Industrial production (output at factories, mines and utilities) is broadly flat, as are retail sales.
    Only the stockmarkets are booming….

    • On June 1, 2014 at 2:43 pm,
      Big Al says:

      Thanks for the summary Profressor

  56. On June 1, 2014 at 4:05 pm,
    Dick Tracy says:

    If we see solar highways in the near future silver will definitely have a rendezvous with much higher prices.http://www.kitco.com/ind/Albrecht/2014-05-30-Solar-Roadways-The-Road-To-The-Future-Paved-In-Silver.html

  57. On June 1, 2014 at 4:32 pm,
    CFS says:

    Jail the Bankers:

    Hang or shoot the politicians who commit constitutional crimes.

    • On June 1, 2014 at 7:43 pm,
      Big Al says:

      Just vote them out with no pensions. I think that would serve the same purpose.

      • On June 1, 2014 at 7:50 pm,
        Birdman says:

        Ha! I don’t think that is one of the ballot options Al

        • On June 1, 2014 at 9:12 pm,
          Big Al says:

          Probably not but it should be!

  58. On June 1, 2014 at 5:11 pm,
    CFS says:

    The EPA is out of control:


    If you let a puddle form on your property, you just potentially lost it……?

    • On June 1, 2014 at 7:45 pm,
      Big Al says:

      Common Professor, things are crazy but not that crazy.

  59. On June 1, 2014 at 5:28 pm,
    Tom says:

    One thing I know for certain is that The Fed has no idea what it is doing! and they have no idea the CHAOS that is coming!

    • On June 1, 2014 at 9:03 pm,
      Big Al says:

      Oh I think everyone knows what is coming!

  60. On June 1, 2014 at 5:29 pm,
    Tom says:

    Did you see that interview with Bernanke? He has no clue what he did of what is happening!

  61. On June 1, 2014 at 6:16 pm,
    CFS says:

    I don’t see as calamitous event as many are predicting. Countries have amazing ways of muddling through.
    I do see problems in the US for decades, possibly centuries.
    I do believe the political process is hopelessly corrupt, and I firmly believe all politicians,
    except for a very few I could count on the fingers of one hand, place their own re-election above all else.
    I also am worried about the possibility of very high inflation in the next decade, and even the possibility of a stupid war.
    There appears no easy way out of terminal decay of the US, nor any get rich quick solution; only danger playing in a rigged market.
    I own a lot of precious metals, to try to preserve wealth, but I expect my heirs not myself to sell them.

    • On June 1, 2014 at 9:06 pm,
      Big Al says:

      And I expect our heirs and not us to sell what we hold!

  62. On June 1, 2014 at 6:36 pm,
    CFS says:

    India buying of gold may decrease more than expected this year due to higher food prices.
    FRom UBS:
    India is the world’s second-largest gold consumer, and a good monsoon season is positively correlated with agricultural crop yields, and in turn farmers’ incomes and higher gold demand.

    “Rural farming areas account for approximately 60 percent of Indian gold buying. How good or bad the monsoon season is has a direct impact on gold demand and in turn prices,” the report said.

    This year’s monsoon is forecast to be delayed by ten days and tempered by a strong El Niño, a band of warm ocean temperatures, according to the Indian Institute of Tropical Meteorology.

    Last time El Niño struck in 2009 monsoon rains were 22 percent below average and subsequently gold demand from India declined 70 percent on the previous year. Still, that figure began at a high base, with 2008 demand having increased 77 percent year on year.

    • On June 1, 2014 at 6:53 pm,
      Birdman says:

      Well that actually makes perfect sense to me, CFS. Over here it is the same. Most buying of gold and silver jewelry is done by farmers after the crop is in. So the season success of agriculture plays a big role. Makes you wonder why some people think that a big downturn in China would result in huge gold buying. That is not how it works. If my house price drops in value then gold is not the first thing that comes to my mind. It would be paying down debt and saving more or trying to increase my income.

      • On June 1, 2014 at 7:06 pm,
        Birdman says:

        Want to hear something interesting though? Yesterday an old man of 86 was telling me and my wife the price for a hundred kilos of wheat in the old days in this part of Africa. My wife had been questioning his story rather doubtfully because his price sounded so preposterously low. I mean stupidly low. She is young though and to her it sounded like the old guy was just exaggerating a story. Anyway, he quoted me the price that was being paid 60 years ago and told me how much it was in local currency at that time. Of course I knew they were using silver coinage almost exclusively back then. So I got one of the popular coins of the day and weighed it….and lo and behold, after converting its weight into dollars and then back into the current money I discovered that price is almost EXACTLY the same today as it was back then. Confirmed what he was saying to a tee. The silver coins actually did buy the exact quantity then as now as though time had stood still. The guy was right.

        • On June 1, 2014 at 9:12 pm,
          bb says:

          Ive seen silver coinage work the same way with gas.

        • On June 2, 2014 at 12:45 am,

          Well 1400 years ago in arabic region one can buy a goat/sheep at a price of 1 dinar gold which is 4.25g of 99.99% gold .. now change this to dollar or MYR ( malaysian ringgit- my country’s currency) .. and u can still it buy with that weight of gold

        • On June 2, 2014 at 9:56 am,
          Matthew says:

          Funny, I’ve been telling you the same thing for more than a year and now it’s suddenly interesting? You scrapped with me constantly (name-calling and all) over this topic. Lol…

          • On June 2, 2014 at 11:51 am,
            Birdman says:

            Actually it was you doing the name calling, Matthew, and some of it was pretty unseemly so don’t bring it up or I will go back bring up all the quotes to prove what an ass you really are.

          • On June 2, 2014 at 1:41 pm,
            Matthew says:

            You’re delusional, but who besides you doesn’t know that? You made it personal because you didn’t like what I had to say. You do the same with everyone you disagree with. To name just two, Gary and Chris have sure experienced it. You never make an argument without attacking the individual who opposes you. You’re a constant BS-er, too, because there are enough buffoons around who can’t detect it.
            You’ve said yourself that you are a “brawler” yet you don’t realize that that is one definition of a world-class ass.

          • On June 2, 2014 at 4:30 pm,
            Birdman says:

            Waaah…waaaah…..waaah….where is mommy when we need her!

  63. On June 1, 2014 at 7:00 pm,
    CFS says:

    I agree it makes sense…..That’s why I posted it.

    If folks look closely, you will see that Kerry used to care about the Constitution.


    • On June 1, 2014 at 9:10 pm,
      Big Al says:

      Do you think he cares about it anymore? I am not so sure. Keep using that catsup!

  64. On June 2, 2014 at 12:34 am,

    Sorry to say … im not an anti-semitic …. semitic means heaven (as-sama’ in arabic)… means religion from God … there’re3 of them … jews religion, christian, and islam
    Well sorry to say … the jews are the first to practice interest rate, yet the banking system nowdays are not pioneered by jews yet by jews-claimed-descendants.. . Such are their well evily planned to worldly life. Jews-claimed-descendants like gold and silver very2 much just like the original jews…,yet they know.. they cannot own all… so they create their own accredited money … such as dollar … jews-disguiser rule … jews-disguser are parasites … oh one more thing … most jews-caimed-to-be-jews-yet-now-some-of-them-are-choosing-irish-names controlling world economy … are not jews actually, its just their ancestors embraced jews religion hundred years ago… they’re descendants of yagug and magug ..a region between turkey, syiria, iran, armeniam caucasia and azerbaijan…and now they’re the owner of federal reserves and all world banks related to them… jp morgan, morgan stanley, goldsachsman… they’re the one whom manipulate gold and silver’s prices … u cant beat them .. only God can

    • On June 2, 2014 at 2:05 pm,
      Big Al says:

      Interesting comment again Nur!

  65. On June 2, 2014 at 3:15 am,
    Skeeta. says:

    I’ve been around the traps long enough to realize that when someone knucklehead starts a sentence with…”I’m sorry to say”…that they are not actually sorry at all.

    So leave your BS about the Jews or any otber religious discrimination you have for another forum / blog

    • On June 2, 2014 at 2:06 pm,
      Big Al says:

      Another one Skeeta, is “truthfully speaking”.

  66. On June 2, 2014 at 3:17 am,
    Skeeta. says:

    Oh…& BTW…I’m a Catholic !

    • On June 2, 2014 at 2:06 pm,
      Big Al says:

      Well now that it two of us.

  67. On June 2, 2014 at 3:25 am,
    Skeeta. says:

    …LOL…& half Irish !!!

    • On June 2, 2014 at 4:25 am,

      If u read my words… im not into jews condemning … yet jews-claiming-to-be …. hihihi

    • On June 2, 2014 at 4:28 am,

      Lol half irish …kikiki … attention … rothschild is not a jew … jews has only 12 tribes … u can refer this , and verify from the quran, the bible and torah … rothschild’s ancestor claiming to comes from the 13th tribe … and that’s the truth …true lies

    • On June 2, 2014 at 4:41 am,

      One more thing bro… and this time im not sorry to say that they’re the manipulators… the fed are owned by them, not the americans … and for God’s sake …we’re all here in bearish position .. prices are stucked and depressed … and we’re all here … because of them .. so I really don’t think that im went above board … denial is just a denial … truth known … hahaha

    • On June 2, 2014 at 5:00 am,

      Ben Shalom Bernanke .. his spouse Anna Friedmann
      Alan Greenspan
      Janet Yellen
      Paul Volcker
      William Miller
      Where do u think they all came from? Pretty obvious

    • On June 2, 2014 at 2:07 pm,
      Big Al says:

      Now that is too bad!

  68. On June 2, 2014 at 5:03 am,

    The conclusion is … the Fed knows what they’re doing … for their interests, off course

    • On June 2, 2014 at 5:26 am,
      Andrew de Berry (Rev) says:

      I’m with Skeeta here. Nur Anbiah is another of those theorist/conspirators who get a few so-called ‘facts’ and bundle them into a package like it’s QED. Quarter truths turned into whole truths are disgusting and however strongly you may protest to the contrary Mr N A B A you’re more anti-Semite than you make out.

      Totally a different matter to abhor what the Zionists are doing with their claims to the West Bank and Gaza along with their longterm ambitions to form a greater Israel from the Nile to the Euphrates.

  69. On June 2, 2014 at 6:03 am,

    Yeah yeah … how many american presidents have been murdered by them? And how many presidents for the last 50 years get elected without their support? U know already how your government has been corrupted by them … trues taste bitter .. u all have been under their spells for centuries … your way of life … the underground rules the surface .. and there is nothing a rev can do to stop them … just preaching .. may be … hehehe

  70. On June 2, 2014 at 6:09 am,

    Federal Reserves … what is that word “federal” got to relate with The Federal of USA when it’s just a privately owned bank??? U tell me!!! How come a private bank determines the financial and economical policies of a soverign country like USA …. nobody knows… how stupid these things are .. heh?

    • On June 2, 2014 at 9:49 am,
      Matthew says:

      Forget Bill Still, read this instead:
      The Creature from Jekyll Island : A Second Look at the Federal Reserve
      by G. Edward Griffin

      • On June 2, 2014 at 10:03 am,
        Andrew de Berry (Rev) says:

        Nice one Matthew – Welcome back,A

        • On June 2, 2014 at 4:32 pm,
          Birdman says:

          Was he gone?

      • On June 2, 2014 at 10:16 am,
        bb says:

        A good book for sure, there is a lot of info in Bill Stills work you are not likely to find elsewhere. His work does begin with Julius Ceaser whereas Jekyll Island doesn’t.
        Bill Still includes those that opposed “moneychangers” for example.

        I kinda think the reason some people don’t appreciate Stills work is his argument that a gold standard is not required, not exactly what a goldbug wants to hear.

        Anyway, information/ education is a good thing, lets hope not too much gets forgotten.

        • On June 2, 2014 at 10:36 am,
          Matthew says:

          I don’t appreciate Still because his conclusions/solutions are just plain wrong. Still’s unbacked paper would reach its intrinsic value even more rapidly than the Fed’s debt-backed ponzi paper. When ANY central authority emits the “money” of the realm, you have theft funding tyranny.

          • On June 2, 2014 at 10:50 am,
            bb says:

            Mat, unbacked paper is what we have now, other than it being fiat of course.
            Still shows quite clearly gold backing changes little and in no way restricts government spending for example.

            Just my opinion but I think an entirely new system required.
            Gold backing just keeps us on the same marrygoround.
            Proof of a new system being required should become evident to most people when we have just about killed everything.
            Just my opinion of course.

          • On June 2, 2014 at 11:53 am,
            Matthew says:

            First, a note is debt. Each Federal Reserve Note is backed by another FRN. Second, U.S. Treasury debt “backs” the dollar because rising demand for it translates into rising demand for the currency used to buy it —the U.S. dollar. Without Fed-created demand (QE), it takes rising real demand to push interest rates lower. The dollar would have more purchasing power right now if the current low interest rates were the result of rising real demand and not due to the creation of new currency (debt) with which to buy the debt.
            Without the existence of interest-bearing debt, trading partners would have no incentive to hoard a currency that is continually debased by a government that can print all it wants.
            Without Fed intervention, the interest rate (set by market demand) would govern the government’s ability and willingness to borrow. Bill Still’s (non) solution would put no such restriction on the government’s ability to spend —however, the resulting crashing currency would.
            By the way, far superior to a gold standard would be market-based money free of any government or central bank control. But how likely is that?

          • On June 2, 2014 at 12:56 pm,
            bb says:

            Matt, Im certain your reasoning of cause and effect are correct.
            Bill Stills non solution is also correct, gold standards dont restrict government spending any more than fiat does.
            A market governed currency might very well be part of a solution, noteably Max Keiser has been presenting this case for years now.
            So, we may actually move to digital, but my guess is we go to something as Bird discussed.
            I don’t think digital will be any more successful than any fiat,gold,chickens or seashells etc.
            I believe whats needed is an entirely new system of exchange, what it is I have no idea, maybe something out of the box like no currency or barter involved, something we cant even imagine today.

            The systems we have been using wether all the differant government structures Plato discusses to our economic systems, they don’t work, none of them, and when they do work, it seems only for a limited time.

            I actually think we are going to find it, but as we only change or deal with anything when we are in crises, we have some pain to go thru yet.

            In the meantime, lets figure out how to make a buck off it.

          • On June 2, 2014 at 1:18 pm,
            Matthew says:

            Systems come with controllers and, therefore, centralized power. Free markets are the best solution.

  71. On June 2, 2014 at 7:34 am,
    bb says:

    Nur, watch “the money masters” by Bill Still on u tube, then youll know how why where and when about the federal reserve.

  72. On June 2, 2014 at 10:29 am,
    bb says:

    “The Primary Owners of the Federal Reserve Bank Are:

    1. Rothschild’s of London and Berlin

    2. Lazard Brothers of Paris

    3. Israel Moses Seaf of Italy

    4. Kuhn, Loeb & Co. of Germany and New York

    5. Warburg & Company of Hamburg, Germany

    6. Lehman Brothers of New York

    7. Goldman, Sachs of New York

    8. Rockefeller Brothers of New York

    All the primary owners are branches of European establishments. Foreigners control the United States Money supply. They literally own exclusive rights to the dollar and simply enter dollars into their banks books to make money which they then lend back to us at a profit. For them money does not grow on trees, it is simply a data entry into their account. Clearly the private ownership of the U.S. Dollar is by far The Greatest Crime of the Century. The owners of this bank have been responsible for instigating all the major wars and depressions in the last 100 years. They own the bank, they own the dollar and they own all the major media channels, the military industrial complex and most politicians, judges and cops.

    Sometimes the bank pays an arbitrary ‘franchise fee’ to the U.S. government to keep the politicians paid off. ”


    END the WARS.
    END the FED

  73. On June 2, 2014 at 10:32 am,
    bb says:

    This federal reserve stuff is nothing new, its been going on from the time of Julius Ceaser, they are who Jesus warned us about, at one time they were known as money changers.

  74. On June 2, 2014 at 10:39 am,
    bb says:

    Chart 1

    Federal Reserve Directors: A Study of Corporate and Banking Influence
    Published 1976
    Chart 1 reveals the linear connection between the Rothschilds and the Bank of England, and the London banking houses which ultimately control the Federal Reserve Banks through their stockholdings of bank stock and their subsidiary firms in New York. The two principal Rothschild representatives in New York, J. P. Morgan Co., and Kuhn,Loeb & Co. were the firms which set up the Jekyll Island Conference at which the Federal Reserve Act was drafted, who directed the subsequent successful campaign to have the plan enacted into law by Congress, and who purchased the controlling amounts of stock in the Federal Reserve Bank of New York in 1914. These firms had their principal officers appointed to the Federal Reserve Board of Governors and the Federal Advisory Council in 1914. In 1914 a few families (blood or business related) owning controlling stock in existing banks (such as in New York City) caused those banks to purchase controlling shares in the Federal Reserve regional banks. Examination of the charts and text in the House Banking Committee Staff Report of August, 1976 and the current stockholders list of the 12 regional Federal Reserve Banks show this same family control.

    N.M. Rothschild , London – Bank of England
    | |
    | J. Henry Schroder

    | Banking | Corp.
    | |
    Brown, Shipley – Morgan Grenfell – Lazard – |
    & Company & Company Brothers |
    | | | |
    ——————–| ——-| | |
    | | | | | |
    Alex Brown – Brown Bros. – Lord Mantagu – Morgan et Cie — Lazard —|
    & Son | Harriman Norman | Paris Bros |
    | | / | N.Y. |
    | | | | | |
    | Governor, Bank | J.P. Morgan Co — Lazard —|
    | of England / N.Y. Morgan Freres |
    | 1924-1938 / Guaranty Co. Paris |
    | / Morgan Stanley Co. | /
    | / | \Schroder Bank
    | / | Hamburg/Berlin
    | / Drexel & Company /
    | / Philadelphia /
    | / /
    | / Lord Airlie
    | / /
    | / M. M. Warburg Chmn J. Henry Schroder
    | | Hamburg ——— marr. Virginia F. Ryan
    | | | grand-daughter of Otto
    | | | Kahn of Kuhn Loeb Co.
    | | |
    | | |
    Lehman Brothers N.Y ————– Kuhn Loeb Co. N. Y.
    | | ————————–
    | | | |
    | | | |
    Lehman Brothers – Mont. Alabama Solomon Loeb Abraham Kuhn
    | | __|______________________|_________
    Lehman-Stern, New Orleans Jacob Schiff/Theresa Loeb Nina Loeb/Paul Warburg
    ————————- | | |
    | | Mortimer Schiff James Paul Warburg
    _____________|_______________/ |
    | | | | |
    Mayer Lehman | Emmanuel Lehman \
    | | | \
    Herbert Lehman Irving Lehman \
    | | | \
    Arthur Lehman \ Phillip Lehman John Schiff/Edith Brevoort Baker
    / | Present Chairman Lehman Bros
    / Robert Owen Lehman Kuhn Loeb – Granddaughter of
    / | George F. Baker
    | / |
    | / |
    | / Lehman Bros Kuhn Loeb (1980)
    | / |
    | / Thomas Fortune Ryan
    | | |
    | | |
    Federal Reserve Bank Of New York |
    |||||||| |
    ______National City Bank N. Y. |
    | | |
    | National Bank of Commerce N.Y —|
    | | \
    | Hanover National Bank N.Y. \
    | | \
    | Chase National Bank N.Y. \
    | |
    | |
    Shareholders – National City Bank – N.Y. |
    —————————————– |
    | /
    James Stillman /
    Elsie m. William Rockefeller /
    Isabel m. Percy Rockefeller /
    William Rockefeller Shareholders – National Bank of Commerce N. Y.
    J. P. Morgan ———————————————–
    M.T. Pyne Equitable Life – J.P. Morgan
    Percy Pyne Mutual Life – J.P. Morgan
    J.W. Sterling H.P. Davison – J. P. Morgan
    NY Trust/NY Edison Mary W. Harriman
    Shearman & Sterling A.D. Jiullard – North British Merc. Insurance
    | Jacob Schiff
    | Thomas F. Ryan
    | Paul Warburg
    | Levi P. Morton – Guaranty Trust – J. P. Morgan
    Shareholders – First National Bank of N.Y.
    J.P. Morgan
    George F. Baker
    George F. Baker Jr.
    Edith Brevoort Baker
    US Congress – 1946-64
    Shareholders – Hanover National Bank N.Y.
    James Stillman
    William Rockefeller
    Shareholders – Chase National Bank N.Y.
    George F. Baker

  75. On June 2, 2014 at 10:40 am,
    bb says:

    Chart 2

    Federal Reserve Directors: A Study of Corporate and Banking Influence
    – Published 1983
    The J. Henry Schroder Banking Company chart encompasses the entire history of the twentieth century, embracing as it does the program (Belgium Relief Commission) which provisioned Germany from 1915-1918 and dissuaded Germany from seeking peace in 1916; financing Hitler in 1933 so as to make a Second World War possible; backing the Presidential campaign of Herbert Hoover ; and even at the present time, having two of its major executives of its subsidiary firm, Bechtel Corporation serving as Secretary of Defense and Secretary of State in the Reagan Administration.

    The head of the Bank of England since 1973, Sir Gordon Richardson, Governor of the Bank of England (controlled by the House of Rothschild) was chairman of J. Henry Schroder Wagg and Company of London from 1963-72, and director of J. Henry Schroder,New York and Schroder Banking Corporation,New York,as well as Lloyd’s Bank of London, and Rolls Royce. He maintains a residence on Sutton Place in New York City, and as head of “The London Connection,” can be said to be the single most influential banker in the world.

    J. Henry Schroder
    Baron Rudolph Von Schroder
    Hamburg – 1858 – 1934
    Baron Bruno Von Schroder
    Hamburg – 1867 – 1940
    F. C. Tiarks |
    1874-1952 |
    | |
    marr. Emma Franziska |
    (Hamburg) Helmut B. Schroder
    J. Henry Schroder 1902 |
    Dir. Bank of England |
    Dir. Anglo-Iranian |
    Oil Company J. Henry Schroder Banking Company N.Y.
    J. Henry Schroder Trust Company N.Y.
    | |
    Allen Dulles John Foster Dulles
    Sullivan & Cromwell Sullivan & Cromwell
    Director – CIA U. S. Secretary of State
    Rockefeller Foundation

    Prentiss Gray
    Belgian Relief Comm. Lord Airlie
    Chief Marine Transportation ———–
    US Food Administration WW I Chairman; Virgina Fortune
    Manati Sugar Co. American & Ryan daughter of Otto Kahn
    British Continental Corp. of Kuhn,Loeb Co.
    | |
    | |
    M. E. Rionda |
    ———— |
    Pres. Cuba Cane Sugar Co. |
    Manati Sugar Co. many other |
    sugar companies. _______|
    | |
    | |
    G. A. Zabriskie |
    ————— | Emile Francoui
    Chmn U.S. Sugar Equalization | ————–
    Board 1917-18; Pres Empire | Belgian Relief Comm. Kai
    Biscuit Co., Columbia Baking | Ping Coal Mines, Tientsin
    Co. , Southern Baking Co. | Railroad,Congo Copper, La
    | Banque Nationale de Belgique
    Suite 2000 42 Broadway | N. Y |
    | | |
    | | |
    Edgar Richard Julius H. Barnes Herbert Hoover
    ————- —————- ————–
    Belgium Relief Comm Belgium Relief Comm Chmn Belgium Relief Com
    Amer Relief Comm Pres Grain Corp. U.S. Food Admin
    U.S. Food Admin U.S. Food Admin Sec of Commerce 1924-28
    1918-24, Hazeltine Corp. 1917-18, C.B Pitney Kaiping Coal Mines
    | Bowes Corp, Manati Congo Copper, President
    | Sugar Corp. U.S. 1928-32
    John Lowery Simpson
    Sacramento,Calif Belgium Relief |
    Comm. U. S. Food Administration Baron Kurt Von Schroder
    Prentiss Gray Co. J. Henry Schroder ———————–
    Trust, Schroder-Rockefeller, Chmn Schroder Banking Corp. J.H. Stein
    Fin Comm, Bechtel International Bankhaus (Hitler’s personal bank
    Co. Bechtel Co. (Casper Weinberger account) served on board of all
    Sec of Defense, George P. Schultz German subsidiaries of ITT . Bank
    Sec of State (Reagan Admin). for International Settlements,
    | SS Senior Group Leader,Himmler’s
    | Circle of Friends (Nazi Fund),
    | Deutsche Reichsbank,president
    Schroder-Rockefeller & Co. , N.Y.
    Avery Rockefeller, J. Henry Schroder
    Banking Corp., Bechtel Co., Bechtel
    International Co. , Canadian Bechtel
    Company. |
    Gordon Richardson
    Governor, Bank of England
    1973-PRESENT C.B. of J. Henry Schroder N.Y.
    Schroder Banking Co., New York, Lloyds Bank
    Rolls Royce

  76. On June 2, 2014 at 10:41 am,
    bb says:

    Chart 3

    Federal Reserve Directors: A Study of Corporate and Banking Influence
    – Published 1976
    The David Rockefeller chart shows the link between the Federal Reserve Bank of New York,Standard Oil of Indiana,General Motors and Allied Chemical Corportion (Eugene Meyer family) and Equitable Life (J. P. Morgan).

    Chairman of the Board
    Chase Manhattan Corp
    Chase Manhattan Corp. |
    Officer & Director Interlocks|———————
    ——|———————– |
    | |
    Private Investment Co. for America Allied Chemicals Corp.
    | |
    Firestone Tire & Rubber Company General Motors
    | |
    Orion Multinational Services Ltd. Rockefeller Family & Associates
    | |
    ASARCO. Inc Chrysler Corp.
    | |
    Southern Peru Copper Corp. Intl’ Basic Economy Corp.
    | |
    Industrial Minerva Mexico S.A. R.H. Macy & Co.
    | |
    Continental Corp. Selected Risk Investments S.A.
    | |
    Honeywell Inc. Omega Fund, Inc.
    | |
    Northwest Airlines, Inc. Squibb Corporation
    | |
    Northwestern Bell Telephone Co. Olin Foundation
    | |
    Minnesota Mining & Mfg Co (3M) Mutual Benefit Life Ins. Co. of NJ
    | |
    American Express Co. AT & T
    | |
    Hewlett Packard Pacific Northwestern Bell Co.
    | |
    FMC Corporation BeachviLime Ltd.
    | |
    Utah Intl’ Inc. Eveleth Expansion Company
    | |
    Exxon Corporation Fidelity Union Bancorporation
    | |
    International Nickel/Canada Cypress Woods Corporation
    | |
    Federated Capital Corporation Intl’ Minerals & Chemical Corp.
    | |
    Equitable Life Assurance Soc U.S. Burlington Industries
    | |
    Federated Dept Stores Wachovia Corporation
    | |
    General Electric Jefferson Pilot Corporation
    | |
    Scott Paper Co. R. J. Reynolds Industries Inc.
    | |
    American Petroleum Institute United States Steel Corp.
    | |
    Richardson Merril Inc. Metropolitan Life Insurance Co.
    | |
    May Department Stores Co. Norton-Simon Inc.
    | |
    Sperry Rand Corporation Stone-Webster Inc.
    | |
    San Salvador Development Company Standard Oil of Indiana

  77. On June 2, 2014 at 10:42 am,
    bb says:

    Chart 4

    Federal Reserve Directors: A Study of Corporate and Banking Influence
    – Published 1976
    This chart shows the interlocks between the Federal Reserve Bank of New York J. Henry Schroder Banking Corp., J. Henry Schroder Trust Co., Rockefeller Center, Inc., Equitable Life Assurance Society ( J.P. Morgan), and the Federal Reserve Bank of Boston.

    Alan Pifer, President
    Carnegie Corporation
    of New York
    Carnegie Corporation
    Trustee Interlocks ————————–
    ———————- |
    | |
    Rockefeller Center, Inc J. Henry Schroder Trust Company
    | |
    The Cabot Corporation Paul Revere Investors, Inc.
    | |
    Federal Reserve Bank of Boston Qualpeco, Inc.
    Owens Corning Fiberglas
    New England Telephone Co.
    Fisher Scientific Company
    Mellon National Corporation
    Equitable Life Assurance Society
    Twentieth Century Fox Corporation
    J. Henry Schroder Banking Corporation

  78. On June 2, 2014 at 10:42 am,
    bb says:

    Chart 5

    Federal Reserve Directors: A Study of Corporate and Banking Influence
    – Published 1976
    This chart shows the link between the Federal Reserve Bank of New York, Brown Brothers Harriman,Sun Life Assurance Co. (N.M. Rothschild and Sons), and the Rockefeller Foundation.

    Maurice F. Granville
    Chairman of The Board
    Texaco Incorporated
    Texaco Officer & Director Interlocks —————- Liggett & Myers, Inc.
    ———————————— |
    | |
    | |
    L Arabian American Oil Company St John d’el Ray Mining Co. Ltd.
    O | |
    N Brown Brothers Harriman & Co. National Steel Corporation
    D | |
    O Brown Harriman & Intl’ Banks Ltd. Massey-Ferguson Ltd.
    N | |
    American Express Mutual Life Insurance Co.
    | |
    N. American Express Intl’ Banking Corp. Mass Mutual Income Investors Inc.
    M. | |
    Anaconda United Services Life Ins. Co.
    R | |
    O Rockefeller Foundation Fairchild Industries
    T | |
    H Owens-Corning Fiberglas Blount, Inc.
    S | |
    C National City Bank (Cleveland) William Wrigley Jr. Co
    H | |
    I Sun Life Assurance Co. National Blvd. Bank of Chicago
    L | |
    D General Reinsurance Lykes Youngstown Corporation
    | |
    General Electric (NBC) Inmount Corporation

    ** Source: Federal Reserve Directors: A Study of Corporate and Banking Influence. Staff Report,Committee on Banking,Currency and Housing, House of Representatives, 94th Congress, 2nd Session, August 1976

  79. On June 2, 2014 at 12:11 pm,
    Birdman says:

    So what are you trying to say?

    • On June 2, 2014 at 12:39 pm,
      bb says:

      The discussion was about the federal reserve being a private bank.
      Nur brings it up.
      The point here is not only to show the owners but they change as well.
      I find the people and companies that do own shares to be interesting.
      I bet a lot of people here didn’t realise they had a personel interest in the fed profiting.
      Maybe thru their ownership of general electric for example.
      Sometimes seeing the relationship of these companies provides clues to events etc.
      Especially where forgein interests are concerned.

      Otherwise, there is no point really, its just info.

      • On June 2, 2014 at 12:45 pm,
        Big Al says:

        Good point bb

        • On June 2, 2014 at 1:09 pm,
          bb says:

          As most of us here agree with Ron Paul for example, “end the fed”
          are people realising they are saying “our entire system has to change?”

          This permeation of moneychangers, oops sorry, rederal reserve, runs more deeply than most imagine.

          • On June 2, 2014 at 4:34 pm,
            Birdman says:

            For the record….I have never agreed with Ron Paul.

          • On June 2, 2014 at 5:08 pm,
            J........the Long.............ootb says:

            bb……….thanks for the charts……………………………….

          • On June 2, 2014 at 5:29 pm,
            bb says:

            Well Bird, we differ on money, and it would seem liberty.
            What system or idea would you suggest instead of liberty?

            For me, liberty is about every answer to people,societies,governments,nations living in peace.

  80. On June 2, 2014 at 5:07 pm,

    bb u are damn right … unfortunately most here do not appreciate real facts

    And matthew, … “the creature from jekyll island”… ? Well we the muslims knew about the narration since 1400 years ago .. it has been documented 1300 years ago. The creature is the one who established USA … he is Uncle Sam … he lives since the prophet Mosses p.b.u.h days .. his name was SAMIRI … he leads the israelite to worship a golden calf that he made using gold they stole from pharoah … check it out from bible and quran … but … this blesphemer made his move when mosses was not around his people, while he went to Sinnai Mountain to receive tasks from God.
    This Samiri is still alive till today … most people would think im crazy … well God has power to do everything… and this case… He permits Samiri alias Sam to live until the end of the world … and he was chained and outcasted/jailed to and island … he broke loose when the prophet Muhammad p.b.u.h was born … why? I don’t know … that was destined and fated by God. Although he was with Mosses and the Israel people at that time … he Is not a jew .. he leads (Samiri is neither a jew nor gog nor magog) the gog and magog who claim to originated from israelite 13th tribe.. while they’re not …..
    Our prophet 1400 years.. has talked about Dajjal (the christian called him anti-christ) … about some of the physical characteristic of this man … he has only one functional eye
    Now … do check into your 1 dollar usd note …. why are there pictures of 13 spears … a pyramid ( an era when mosses lived … and samiri/ uncle sam was there also) and an ‘eye’ above the summit of the pyramid … what strange things got to do with America?? ?.. there’re more details that are too many to be told …

    • On June 2, 2014 at 5:40 pm,
      J........the Long.............ootb says:

      Nur…………the Israelites did not “steal the gold”……..
      .Exodus 3 -21,
      “And I will make the Egyptians favorably disposed toward this people, so that when you leave you will not go empty handed.”
      Exodus 3 -22………Every women is to ask her neighbor and any woman living in her house for articles of silver and gold and for clothing , which you will put on your sons and daughters.

      • On June 2, 2014 at 5:43 pm,
        J........the Long.............ootb says:

        beside…….the 10 commands…….Thou shall not steal……..

  81. On June 2, 2014 at 5:35 pm,

    Now…people who really read… and have passion and interest about truth im telling… would be asking me this: if these intelligent and evil people of gog and magog that established world banking, financial and economical system, control the media and the hollywood ARE NOT JEWS or any known race or tribes … where were they before? Is there any track of their civilization? ?.. well they were trapped and fenced with high strong walls from the outside world by Alexander The Great (the real one … not the other 2 or 3 … u need to study this) … so u wouldn’t see any of their previous achievement … yet when they were freed by God’s decree … and went to Europe … well well well … no need to check any civilization … they’re the one who determine the form and shape of world civilizations, way of life… money and mostly everything … u can’t beat them … they’re the one who established USA … and also RUSSIA … they gave loan to the north ( capital from their bank in england) and to the south (capital from their bank in france) .. during america civil war … , they’re the one who back up the democrats … as well as the republicans … they’re in each powerful opposite rivals … u just can’t beat .. only God can … and God lets them be … because He has planned and knows the outcomes … our duties are to worship Him, do good deeds, avoid bad deeds, work, then leave it to God and then pray … bye

  82. On June 2, 2014 at 5:54 pm,

    J…the …long … ootb … may be u’re right… because if they did stole… mosses would punished them, … yet they’re poor, 2nd class community during pharoah time, and made and treated as slaves by the pharoah … how did they manage to have lot of gold back then? ?… hoarding since the start of world… may be… while mosses would not care any materialistic things or worldly life for he is the messenger of God

    • On June 2, 2014 at 6:33 pm,
      J........the Long.............ootb says:

      Nur……..Nothing is impossible with God…they had all they needed, and were supplied quite well from the Egyptians as noted in Exodus 3……..You are correct that they became 2 nd class under the Egyptians, but, they put themselves in bondage for food at the beginning.

  83. On June 3, 2014 at 11:41 am,
    Ron says:

    Thank you Jay Taylor for your reference back to the Creator, for HE is the only way we have a chance to get things right again. It’s with the young people though, that I do have hope. We fumbled the ball back in the 60’s and 70’s, and it’s going to take our kids and grand kids to fix it….with our support all the way.